Heck yeah, separation of church and state. And js, but the bible says some pretty crazy stuff. Deuteronomy 22:28-29 for instance "If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and seizes her and lies with her and they are discovered, then the man who lay with her shall give her father fifty sheckles of silver, and she shall become his wife, because he as violated her; he cannot divorce her all his days", like sure that makes sense in olden times, but are you really going to tell me that every dude who rapes a girl, they should have to get married? By the way, this isn't even the only verse that says this, though I forget what the other one was.
No only if he's truly sorry. Besides of your gay and you weren't raised a Catholic, you don't have any Catholic views, then there's no way you could possibly think what your doing is wrong.
A religion like the one described here shouldn't stand. Who's right is it to say gay marriage is bad? Believe in a god but don't let your beliefs make other people suffer. I've had many arguments with religious people. Some regular religious people and some wack jobs. If belonging to a religion that is how I've heard makes me a good person in people's eyes. I'd rather be a bad person
To be fair, he didn't tear down a religion. He didn't say Catholic, Christian Reform, Muslim, etc. He said any religion that pushes those beliefs. Which makes his point that much stronger and shows he isn't just painting all people with the same brush.
so pretty much he's saying that morality and responsibility are bad, and repentance is even worse.
That's kinda sad. A world without repentance would be miserable indeed.
Okay I was confused I didn't understand their comment either but yours makes it make sense.
And morality isn't exclusive to religion. When your an athiest all your morals don't fly out the window and you think it's fine to kill a bunch of people.
You also don't need to ask for forgiveness if you've don't nothing wrong, which those who aren't straight have not done anything wrong. Unless they themselves are an asshole.
Just because you say sorry doesn't make everything you've done go away. There are still marks, and I believe that anyone who does that to a child is going to hell regardless of how sorry they are, because them repenting doesn't make it easier for those children to trust people or to have a functioning relationship. If you extinguish someone's whole life, you take away all of their chances, firsts and seconds, and that means you take away your second chance as well. You can get good soul points for good behavior, but that doesn't mean you get to go dine with Jesus when you've done that much bad.
Repentance isn't just saying "oops, my bad." It's a process that changes who you are. It's the way for everything to be made right again. Of course you can't always (if ever) fix the damage and make it like it never happened, but who says it needs to be? If someone is truly repentant, God says forgive them. If you cannot do that, then that is your mistake, not theirs. Jesus was clear about this.
Besides the fact that this guy clearly has no functioning concept of religion anyway, what he is saying is that it doesn't make sense to have moral standards that are higher than he thinks they need to be. It's a classic "how dare you think you have standards higher (or at least different) than mine?" It's really just another form of self-righteousness.
He's saying that it doesn't make sense to be the biggest sinner in the world. To kill and to rape and every other horrid thing possible. And just because you "repent" all will be forgiven. Yet what it sounds like to me is you're saying his moral standards aren't where they need to be because he believes gays should be able to marry. And by thinking that, his "moral standard" is below some religious persons who believes gays shouldn't be married because the bible and "god" apparently say it shouldn't be. I'd say his morals are above that of someone who doesn't believe in gay marriage
The entire second post of your response makes no sense to me whatsoever. As for the first, if it's my mistake to not accept child molesters, then that's a mistake I will gladly make, because doing that to a child, in my books, is not something that can ever be washed clean. I was molested for seven /years/ by the same religious man, and frankly, if him repenting can get him into heaven, quite honestly, I don't want to be there, no matter how much he "changed". Because if there is something so wrong with you that you will do those things, that you enjoy it, I don't think anything changes but your desire to be accepted into society.
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I don't support the idea of repentance because I know so many people who (and I know this isn't how it works) will do something and then just go 'eh, I can repent', like that washes away any wrong they've done. Those people won't go to heaven, but the fact that they will keep doing it isn't okay with me.
I don't see where I said that his standard weren't where they need to be (but if you asked me, I'd say they probably weren't... But then, whose are.) We don't have to agree whose standards are 'higher' than whose. Let's just go with 'different', and my point still stands.
If you guys don't like the concept of repentance and forgiveness, take it up with Jesus. He's the one who introduced radical concepts such as this. To be honest, your grudges against and lack of faith in someone are no reason why they can't change. If you were to hypothetically see such a person in heaven and it made you so uncomfortable, then ultimately you would be the one that would need to leave. Grudges don't belong there.
Just a point of clarification though : Jesus asks that we forgive all men, not necessarily that we trust all men. Trust is another issue.
And yes, missraven, you're right, that isn't how it works. That's not true repentance, and therefore is not what I'm talking about.
I'm all for forgiveness but I feel there's a certaint point that forgiveness is no longer possible. At that point it shouldn't matter what you do. You should be going to hell. Funny. I'm talking like heaven and hell and god exist. I've said it before. If religion and belief in god means being and doing all the things people say it does. I'm glad I'm not a religious person and I'm glad I pretty much don't believe in god. I wouldn't want to be a part of something that's the way I've seen it described. I'd rather be a good person in the eyes of people than potentially piss "god" off. I could rant on and on but it's not worth it. Religious people sometimes lack morals and common sense lmao
Also, why are you okay with tearing people down but not okay with tearing an oppression down. lol.
That's kinda sad. A world without repentance would be miserable indeed.
And morality isn't exclusive to religion. When your an athiest all your morals don't fly out the window and you think it's fine to kill a bunch of people.
You also don't need to ask for forgiveness if you've don't nothing wrong, which those who aren't straight have not done anything wrong. Unless they themselves are an asshole.
Besides the fact that this guy clearly has no functioning concept of religion anyway, what he is saying is that it doesn't make sense to have moral standards that are higher than he thinks they need to be. It's a classic "how dare you think you have standards higher (or at least different) than mine?" It's really just another form of self-righteousness.
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I don't support the idea of repentance because I know so many people who (and I know this isn't how it works) will do something and then just go 'eh, I can repent', like that washes away any wrong they've done. Those people won't go to heaven, but the fact that they will keep doing it isn't okay with me.
If you guys don't like the concept of repentance and forgiveness, take it up with Jesus. He's the one who introduced radical concepts such as this. To be honest, your grudges against and lack of faith in someone are no reason why they can't change. If you were to hypothetically see such a person in heaven and it made you so uncomfortable, then ultimately you would be the one that would need to leave. Grudges don't belong there.
Just a point of clarification though : Jesus asks that we forgive all men, not necessarily that we trust all men. Trust is another issue.
And yes, missraven, you're right, that isn't how it works. That's not true repentance, and therefore is not what I'm talking about.