I think an important question is which doctors?
I know a guy who got vaccinated, had had covid, and ended up not being able to breathe if he even walked briskly
He saw 5 different doctors/specialists to try to find out what the issue was (I.e. what the damage was and whether it was caused by covid, the vaccine, or both) and got 5 different opinions
Nevermind the doctors being silenced and buried for not towing the party line.
Remember hydrox-whatever? Ivermectin? Or even all the ones who suggested that the jabs (had to change the definitions just to call them vaccines) would lose efficacy or was otherwise less than God's own perfect cure?
Politics and science shouldn’t really mix, but they almost always have. The previous administration rushed a vaccine to production and then pushed it into the public using an emergency order for mostly political and economic reasons. We are now suffering the effects of that. It can take years, decades, or even centuries to develop and proof out a new treatment. Accelerating that process put a medicine into the public which was still in an early state of scientific progress. Science is ever changing, but the earlier we are in the process the more unsure and quickly changing things are. Most people aren’t scientists and don’t think scientifically, but they are now in the middle of the scientific process at an early and dynamic stage. It’s understandable so many can’t fully understand what is going on and look for the the simplest and most understandable explanation to ease their confusion. It’s human nature. We prefer an incorrect certainty to a confusing reality.
Scientists and doctors aren’t perfect, and many are themselves acting out of personal or political motivations wether they champion or oppose the current vaccines efficacy.
That said, how many people are vaccinated world wide and how many have died? How many people world wide have died without the vaccine?
You don’t really need to be an expert or listen to a doctor or scientist to see a pattern in the numbers- more dead people without the vaccine than dead people with the vaccine.
The vaccine is generally not more dangerous than the virus based on current numbers.
No let's go deeper let's look at comorbidities, age, profit incentives to up the count, politics behind the counts, the increase in strokes, heart issues, the mortal sins being covered up, who is and isn't liable for things going wrong, the effective treatments still being suppressed, how long information and details are sealed.
And nice try trying to blame Trump. As if the jab wasn't politicized by Biden and his ilk.
We don't know Jack. And we don't know shit about the numbers except that they cannot be trusted
“Now try trying to blame the guy who fast tracked a vaccine under his promise to have a vaccine ready in record time and then filed an emergency order to bypass the review process. The guy AFTER him is the one who did it!”
Look, I get it. You like Trump. Not here to discuss him. He did what he did. Is it “his fault?” Really it’s the public, the public was and still is foaming at the mouth to be rid of covid worries. What was he supposed to do- tell people to wait in lockdown for 5-10 years?
Not everything is blame famousone. Facts are facts, just because facts aren’t what we want doesn’t make them insults and doesn’t mean we can ignore the ones we don’t like.
Joe Biden rushed the FDA approval. He didn’t start the train, trump did, but he didn’t put the brakes on. Am I saying he’s to blame? Not exactly. He was under the same pressures as trump, maybe worse. There’s a vaccine, trump has said “you can have it..” then Biden is supposed to say: “you can’t have the vaccine…
I'm not talking about the mess around development. I'm talking about the divisions being sown by the likes of Biden pretending every success as his own, Harris and other notable Dems calling on people to boycott "Trump's vaccine", those idiots all deliberately worsening the situation in nursing homes and hospitals, and then turning around threatening to go full Gestapo on people with the audacity to celebrate Thanksgiving.
I'm glad it's an option, I fucking wish any information around it could be trusted. All I want is for our rights as individuals and humans to be respected by our servants.
Most people do. Which is why not everyone liked him. What’s good for the spider is usually not good for the fly- who is which depends on the day and who’s in charge I suppose.
It is rather foolish to oppose a vaccine just because of who was in power when it was made or who released it to the public, but I’m not sure I follow what you’re saying about nursing homes and all that being worsened by “dems” and I’m not sure about the whole “Biden claiming every success as his own” part or what that has to do with the issues at hand? It’s generally the case that standing presidents benefit from work done or set in motion by their predecessors. Our previous president took credit for things that were the effect of his predecessor, and the current and previous president also carried the burdens of things done by previous ones. As said though, this isn’t about presidents and science shouldn’t be tied to politics so I’m not here for that.
The best figures we have are what we have.
There's no way you are ignorant of Coumo mass murdering elders in nursing homes. And I mean exactly what I said, Biden came into office claiming that the distribution and research already done and underway was thanks to him. And other top Party leaders, many of the same ones calling for mandates or otherwise forcing and punishing the unjabbed, were calling for boycotts and attacking the companies behind them during Trump's term.
This is about politics, there is no science around covid in America and the West that hasn't been tainted.
The "figures we have" are compromised. By faulty testing, incentives, political gain, and outright lies.
Ah. Cuomo. Yeah, I am aware, I didn’t quite get the reference or where it was coming from in relation to the discussion- the fact that the number of deaths because of covid had actually been manipulated to make it seem LESS deadly in one of the most populous American metros would seem to go to my point that the total deaths from covid are greater than the deaths from the vaccine by a whopping margin.
Where are the numbers that haven’t been manipulated for gain or from perception bias? Arguably they don’t exist. Every census, vote, study- wrong. Do you think teacher actually counted every jelly bean in the jar for “estimation” lessons- or did they more likely average the beans based on weight/volume of the bags it took or just make a number up?
Even if we count the beans- two people might come up with different totals, so completely unbiased numbers can still have mistakes.
Guys who’s job it is to drop shells in a specific place Biff that up here and there under stress or just in training. That’s literal life and death- sometimes if people you know- and the numbers are wrong sometimes or how they are read is wrong.
There is no “perfect” in life, and there is no “certain” in science. If you want a 100% in life, outside maybe the fact it ends eventually, you aren’t going to find it.
So the numbers aren’t perfect but they’re the numbers we have. If we are going to challenge the numbers and say they’re wrong- we need to offer up numbers and put them through the same scrutiny and see what comes out.
The fact the numbers reveal the same trend across most of the world though somewhat rules out that any single nation is making it all up, and that almost ALL would is somewhat unprecedented.
But I’ll put it another way: if HALF the deaths from covid are fake data- that’s still more people than both of us will ever know or even meet.
I know a guy who got vaccinated, had had covid, and ended up not being able to breathe if he even walked briskly
He saw 5 different doctors/specialists to try to find out what the issue was (I.e. what the damage was and whether it was caused by covid, the vaccine, or both) and got 5 different opinions
Remember hydrox-whatever? Ivermectin? Or even all the ones who suggested that the jabs (had to change the definitions just to call them vaccines) would lose efficacy or was otherwise less than God's own perfect cure?
That said, how many people are vaccinated world wide and how many have died? How many people world wide have died without the vaccine?
You don’t really need to be an expert or listen to a doctor or scientist to see a pattern in the numbers- more dead people without the vaccine than dead people with the vaccine.
The vaccine is generally not more dangerous than the virus based on current numbers.
And nice try trying to blame Trump. As if the jab wasn't politicized by Biden and his ilk.
We don't know Jack. And we don't know shit about the numbers except that they cannot be trusted
Look, I get it. You like Trump. Not here to discuss him. He did what he did. Is it “his fault?” Really it’s the public, the public was and still is foaming at the mouth to be rid of covid worries. What was he supposed to do- tell people to wait in lockdown for 5-10 years?
Not everything is blame famousone. Facts are facts, just because facts aren’t what we want doesn’t make them insults and doesn’t mean we can ignore the ones we don’t like.
Joe Biden rushed the FDA approval. He didn’t start the train, trump did, but he didn’t put the brakes on. Am I saying he’s to blame? Not exactly. He was under the same pressures as trump, maybe worse. There’s a vaccine, trump has said “you can have it..” then Biden is supposed to say: “you can’t have the vaccine…
Come on. It is what it is. It was rushed.
That doesn’t change the numbers.
It is rather foolish to oppose a vaccine just because of who was in power when it was made or who released it to the public, but I’m not sure I follow what you’re saying about nursing homes and all that being worsened by “dems” and I’m not sure about the whole “Biden claiming every success as his own” part or what that has to do with the issues at hand? It’s generally the case that standing presidents benefit from work done or set in motion by their predecessors. Our previous president took credit for things that were the effect of his predecessor, and the current and previous president also carried the burdens of things done by previous ones. As said though, this isn’t about presidents and science shouldn’t be tied to politics so I’m not here for that.
The best figures we have are what we have.
This is about politics, there is no science around covid in America and the West that hasn't been tainted.
The "figures we have" are compromised. By faulty testing, incentives, political gain, and outright lies.
Where are the numbers that haven’t been manipulated for gain or from perception bias? Arguably they don’t exist. Every census, vote, study- wrong. Do you think teacher actually counted every jelly bean in the jar for “estimation” lessons- or did they more likely average the beans based on weight/volume of the bags it took or just make a number up?
Even if we count the beans- two people might come up with different totals, so completely unbiased numbers can still have mistakes.
There is no “perfect” in life, and there is no “certain” in science. If you want a 100% in life, outside maybe the fact it ends eventually, you aren’t going to find it.
So the numbers aren’t perfect but they’re the numbers we have. If we are going to challenge the numbers and say they’re wrong- we need to offer up numbers and put them through the same scrutiny and see what comes out.
The fact the numbers reveal the same trend across most of the world though somewhat rules out that any single nation is making it all up, and that almost ALL would is somewhat unprecedented.
But I’ll put it another way: if HALF the deaths from covid are fake data- that’s still more people than both of us will ever know or even meet.