Something that has always stick with me. The attacker without the gun could disarm you and now they have it... one thing to have a gun. Another thing how to handle it. And to know when to use it!
how? if it’s safely stored, locked, unloaded, and given the proper respect and education necessary (ie always treating it as if it is loaded to as to not take any unsafe actions, obeying the “laser” and range rules), how exactly can an accident happen?
firearms “accidents” are entirely as a result of negligence. for every “accidental” death there are measures that could have and SHOULD have taken place to prevent disaster. same with nearly everything in life. there are very few real accidents in life and there are absolutely none in the use of firearms.
Usually if only having a weapon is enough to be safe, you probably didn’t need the weapon. If someone carries a weapon for protection, I agree training is essential, otherwise the weapon is usually more of a liability.
As for accidents… accidents DO happen. People shoot themselves or others while unloading firearms for storage. People make mistakes when storing a fire arm or handling a fire arm and it is loaded.
Nuclear power plants have accidents, airlines have accidents, 1.35 MILLION people die a year from accidents on the roadways.
There are slip and fall accidents in bathtubs and… well… accidents happen. That is why they are called accidents. We mitigate them as best we can and take seriously the responsibility of our actions, a power tool, a kitchen knife, a vehicle, a backyard swimming pool, a gun, medicines and cleaning supplies- accidents happen but that is the cost of having tools that are both useful and potentially dangerous if handled improperly or under certain circs
fair enough, but with the exception of the bathtub example i disagree. vehicle accidents happen because someone wasn’t paying attention, or didn’t maintain their vehicle properly, or the roadway wasn’t maintained, causing damage, or someone was careless in their driving, or any number of preventable reasons- but you’ll be hard pressed to find a single MVA that didn’t have a preventable cause. the major nuclear power plant incidents were the result of improper maintenance, negligence, natural disaster (in the case of Japan), or, in the case of Chernobyl, lethal carelessness, and only in the case of natural disaster is it not really anyones fault, and even then it could have been better planned and prepared for. put simply, with the exception of extreme examples, there are no “real” accidents.
as for firearms, i’ll stand my ground here and say that when loading and unloading a weapon, ANY weapon, there are simple steps that must be taken to do so safely EVERY time to prevent a misfire.
(cont.) if these steps are not followed, someone can get hurt or killed. but again, i cannot stress enough that that is not a true accident, that is negligence and a lack of training and respect for the weapon, which can be solved by simply taking the proper steps. there is always another step that can be taken to render a situation safer and prevent an incident from happening, and if all the steps are taken then barring an absolute act of God you will have no incidents or “accidents”.
By and large I agree- or at least my point isn’t that because bad things CAN happen means we should just hide away anything that might hurt someone. At the end of the day there aren’t really many if any human made “accidents” that ultimately aren’t preventable- in a more ultimate sense there’s almost nothing that can happen to us that can’t be said to be our fault in some way- unless one believes in some immovable concept of destiny. If your house is destroyed in a Tropical storm in Florida- you have every reason to assume that a reasonable possibility. California wild fire? That’s what trees do- especially in a desert. And it could as easily have been an earthquake. Washington state has a massive volcano and we know this. Anyone within perhaps hundreds or more miles of that thing is gambling that because it hasn’t gone off in the most extreme case yet, it won’t in their lives.
A space station falls on your home? Well- I’ll grant it is absurd to expect that, but you could have…
… lived somewhere else or you could have built a fortified underground home perhaps etc etc. the catch is always in reasonable. You or I or whoever is on a jury or in a court room or acting to make or enforce rules in good faith, sets up rules largely on THEIR definition of reasonable. Part is perspective- we know what we know and have lived the lives we’ve lived. A handy person might wonder how any sane person could think they could wash their polished concrete floors with alcohol but most people who aren’t chemists or aware of the care of such surfaces don’t know how alcohol can damage such a finish. Lots of examples- but a principle often driving egalitarian freedom- or at least the traditional American concept, is some form of consideration for the perspective of others.
Chiefly, that while myself or many others never or rarely drink and could be fine- perhaps better- in a world without booze- it offends my sensibilities that despite all the harms and death alcohol causes that someone can’t make that choice. I have no problems with the concept of compulsory military or some form of public service and even somewhat favor the idea in concept- but I know MANY have a problem with it and the abuse of freedom potential in allowing that as well as the fact that I believe people should serve because they want to, not be forced- mean I couldn’t support such a move beyond theoretically. So when we start talking about freedoms- people who enjoy have THEIR freedoms but lack civics are often first to try and take things away from other people that they themselves won’t miss.
Many people want to create the world THEY want to live in and will sacrifice others ways to do so. Of course- we are all guilty to a degree. That’s what that concept of reasonable is, that is what sits behind most law. The mass murderer or pimp may not find those crimes offensive or out of the ordinary- but when a large group gets together and decides that those things aren’t things they are worried about being arrested for- they will support prohibition if it suits their way of life or ability to live the life they want. Weed has become legalized in increasing measure in part due to increased social liberalism but largely because a lot of people like weed or byproducts and don’t want to worry about going to jail to enjoy it.
So I mean- of course there is some middle ground in these things that is practical and compassionate. We can’t really have a well functioning society if anything that happens is your fault for not preventing it, nor one where no one is ever accountable for anything. We can’t really say that because it is a majority imposing their will on a minority or because we allow weed or drinking that we have to allow murder or be bullies or bigots. Reality requires some balance point to be practical and humanity requires some wiggle room.
But all that asides- the best trained most experienced and cautious people have accidents with machines all the time. We can say they obviously weren’t the most cautious or they wouldn’t have an accident- but…. That’s an extreme judgment. Humans are humans. Sooner or later everyone makes a mistake. They forget something, they skip a step, something else changes the equation- it only takes one time. Some machines are more dangerous than others. If you’re baking a cake and it doesn’t turn out perfect because you skipped a step or set the oven wrong- it’s likely no big deal. If an open hear surgeon misses a step or messes up with a surgical robot- someone could die or be paralyzed for life etc. so…. A practical middle ground is one where we give people a freedom to access dangerous machines but we impose certain requirements on their fitness. Even then accidents will happen- but… we mitigate such things where possible.
firearms “accidents” are entirely as a result of negligence. for every “accidental” death there are measures that could have and SHOULD have taken place to prevent disaster. same with nearly everything in life. there are very few real accidents in life and there are absolutely none in the use of firearms.
As for accidents… accidents DO happen. People shoot themselves or others while unloading firearms for storage. People make mistakes when storing a fire arm or handling a fire arm and it is loaded.
Nuclear power plants have accidents, airlines have accidents, 1.35 MILLION people die a year from accidents on the roadways.
There are slip and fall accidents in bathtubs and… well… accidents happen. That is why they are called accidents. We mitigate them as best we can and take seriously the responsibility of our actions, a power tool, a kitchen knife, a vehicle, a backyard swimming pool, a gun, medicines and cleaning supplies- accidents happen but that is the cost of having tools that are both useful and potentially dangerous if handled improperly or under certain circs
as for firearms, i’ll stand my ground here and say that when loading and unloading a weapon, ANY weapon, there are simple steps that must be taken to do so safely EVERY time to prevent a misfire.
A space station falls on your home? Well- I’ll grant it is absurd to expect that, but you could have…