And then every woman got sent to prison?
Right?
There's self-defense and then there is just unnecessary murder.
Especially if the person is already in the middle of the trial, there is no reason to murder them.
Someone give me a source on this bullshit.
I'm pretty sure the last time a major person was repeatedly stabbed out/inside of an official government building was Julius Caesar. If that happened now, all 200 girls regardless of their sex would probably be referred to as a mob and arrested.
I'm going to get hate, which I'm prepared to handle but in an appropriate manner. The amount of psychological trauma rape does to you is unthinkable and probably worse then murder. In my opinion and my opinion alone, he got off easy.
Well if you are murdered you can't suffer psychological trauma cuz youre fucking dead. So yeah it does give more psychological trauma than murder because murder gives you none. And rape isn't worse than murder because with murder you cease to fucking exist....
I argue that assault and rape aren't really that different. What makes rape so much worse? I suspect that it's the social implications of rape, not the actual rape itself that makes it bad. Either way, it's assault and battery.
Assault is when someone is insulted or harmed. A person get beaten/yelled at/whatever, they get scared, they may zone out and it's probably one of the most traumatizing things in their lives; But it's not them getting violated in a way that is the opposite of the loving they have reserved for themselves/their lovers/no one. Everyone should get to be in charge of their own bodies, and rapists are not only violating that right but also emotionally traumatizing their victims. Technically speaking, rape is a kind of assault, but it is considered so much worse because of the emotional repercussions of the victims.
And assault doesn't have emotional repercussions? I'm not trying to denigrate the effects of rape, but I really don't see how, besides the societal implications, rape is any worse than a bad assault.
Assault does have emotional repercussions, I would know. But people who have gone through rape often have a harder time coping with what has happened. Many young, otherwise healthy people has gone mad or killed themselves because of feelings of self-hatred or disgust with their own bodies. Rape /taints/. Assault is also a very bad and unethical thing that happens to good people every day and destroy many lives as well, but victims of assault more often have it easier to "bounce back" into society and continue living their lives as they used to.
But let me get this clear: This is not a competition of which crime is worse. ALL crimes are crimes for a reason. Murder is not a healthy way to get revenge, Assaults of any kind are all degrading and in some cases emotionally scarring. I am not saying that what these women did was right, just that it was justified in their eyes since they had been so very hurt and broken after what this man did to them and their families.
You know why they hate themselves? Because society. Rape isn't inherently worse than "normal" assault, it's that we made it so for some reason. Maybe because "ooh sex is bad"? Maybe because weakness is frowned upon (but for some reason weakness when being beat is "acceptable")? I don't know. But I firmly believe that rape is no worse than "normal" assault by an objective measure. Unless you "normal" assault along with the rape but that's two different things that happen at once.
And that is your opinion. I am merely informing you about the different repercussions that different kinds of assault can bring because it seems that you do not fully understand what I was telling you. I said that this was not a competition about which crime was worse. Both of above mentioned crimes are illegal for the sake of the mental states of the victims. Do I need to repeat myself?
I'm not sure I'm making it a competition, I'm not trying to. I'm also not sure of the point you're trying to make anymore because it seems we've deviated from the original point. I'm saying rape isn't inherently worse than assault and you're neither agreeing or disagreeing with me. Yes?
... I'm too tired for this arguing bullshit.
Yes, I agree that in the eye of the law, rape is not worse than assault. But in the eyes of people, as myself, however, it is different. Are we done?
I'm not arguing
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Why is it different in the people's eyes? There is no reason for it to be.
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I'm 80% sure that the law treats rape and assault differently. Let's use WA laws and a person with no criminal record. Second and third degree rape seem most equal to second degree assault in terms of the severity of crime. 2nd deg assault is 3-12 months prison. 2nd and 3rd degree rape carries 5 yr to life imprisonment and/or $10k-50k fines. We can clearly see that rape carries a much heavier sentence, at least five times worse.
Okay, so hi, I know this isn't my discussion but I just wanted to get Chu's questions answered. I completely understand where you're coming from and as said by Gamzee I don't want this to be a fight because that's not what I mean to come across as at all and I'm sure you're the same.
To answer your "Why is it different in people's eyes?" question, of course the way people see crimes like these is completely subjective and you can never truly understand what any of them are like unless you've experienced them yourself, and sadly maybe you have. Assault is horrible, any crime is horrible, that's why it's a crime at all. In my eyes both assault and rape are disgusting and, well down right pathetic to stoop too. And that's that, every individual is different, with different morals, values etc. As long as you respect my opinion as I respect yours then that's pretty much all I have to say, if you any any other questions though, I can try and answer them for you.
No, I'm certainly not a professional but like I said everyones reactions to the same type of assault (sexual or not) is going to be different. I don't think social constructs play a massive role in this, it's more the fact that we have research that supports that the brains actual connections change, thus effecting our emotional state after being assaulted and that there are greater negative effects on rape victims. This is shown in research, there's heaps of articles and things if you want to look it up for better clarification cause like I said, I'm not an expert. Hope this was helpful
Hey no problem gamzee! Just trying to help clear things up a bit :)
So the way society stigmatises rape does not change how traumatising it is, I would leave it there but I guess it would help with some explaining. Social standards don't play a massive role in the way the victims brain physically changes. I can see where you're coming from because of course victims find it hard to reach out to others as it is seen as a rare thing to happen but it's more the fact that the victim feels 'tainted' and not because of the way society depicts it. Rape prevents you from trusting others as you did before, this changes forever, it increases your cortisol levels in stressful situations and damages your ability to empathise as your body shuts this down to make it easier to cope with the trauma. Just to make a clear answer for your question, the answer is NO, social constructs and views on rape DO NOT change the severity of the experience. Sort of getting it now? hopefully?
No, we don't. Cultures are irrelevant as the psychological effects are to PEOPLE not cultures. Animals brains are different, therefore the effects are different but if you want to study up on that you can. I'm glad I've made things better understood for you and that you took all my answers well. I'm going to enjoy the rest of my day, hope you do the same.
Well see there's a claim and thanks to the scientific method the best way to verify this claim is to study variables. But whatever. My basic question was answered.
I don't believe my comments said anything about assault. I missed all that. Anyway, I am acknowledging my bias and dropping out of the argument. No need to cause any more division, right?
Right?
There's self-defense and then there is just unnecessary murder.
Especially if the person is already in the middle of the trial, there is no reason to murder them.
Someone give me a source on this bullshit.
But murder?
No
But let me get this clear: This is not a competition of which crime is worse. ALL crimes are crimes for a reason. Murder is not a healthy way to get revenge, Assaults of any kind are all degrading and in some cases emotionally scarring. I am not saying that what these women did was right, just that it was justified in their eyes since they had been so very hurt and broken after what this man did to them and their families.
Yes, I agree that in the eye of the law, rape is not worse than assault. But in the eyes of people, as myself, however, it is different. Are we done?
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Why is it different in the people's eyes? There is no reason for it to be.
--
I'm 80% sure that the law treats rape and assault differently. Let's use WA laws and a person with no criminal record. Second and third degree rape seem most equal to second degree assault in terms of the severity of crime. 2nd deg assault is 3-12 months prison. 2nd and 3rd degree rape carries 5 yr to life imprisonment and/or $10k-50k fines. We can clearly see that rape carries a much heavier sentence, at least five times worse.
To answer your "Why is it different in people's eyes?" question, of course the way people see crimes like these is completely subjective and you can never truly understand what any of them are like unless you've experienced them yourself, and sadly maybe you have. Assault is horrible, any crime is horrible, that's why it's a crime at all. In my eyes both assault and rape are disgusting and, well down right pathetic to stoop too. And that's that, every individual is different, with different morals, values etc. As long as you respect my opinion as I respect yours then that's pretty much all I have to say, if you any any other questions though, I can try and answer them for you.
So the way society stigmatises rape does not change how traumatising it is, I would leave it there but I guess it would help with some explaining. Social standards don't play a massive role in the way the victims brain physically changes. I can see where you're coming from because of course victims find it hard to reach out to others as it is seen as a rare thing to happen but it's more the fact that the victim feels 'tainted' and not because of the way society depicts it. Rape prevents you from trusting others as you did before, this changes forever, it increases your cortisol levels in stressful situations and damages your ability to empathise as your body shuts this down to make it easier to cope with the trauma. Just to make a clear answer for your question, the answer is NO, social constructs and views on rape DO NOT change the severity of the experience. Sort of getting it now? hopefully?
Naw! *hugs gamzee back* you are too