Literally no one:
Jk Rowling: “I’ve created a world from my imagination for you!”
Literally most people: “Yay!”
Jk Rowling: “here are more books and ideas from me!”
Literally more people: “yay! Keep them coming!”
Jk Rowling: “ok! I will! Here are plot twists and turns from my imagination!”
Literally more people: “Yes! But no! So sad, so good!”
Jk Rowling: “My books are done.”
Everyone: “Awwww...”
Rowling: “Ok. I’ll add more.”
Most everyone: “Yay.”
Rowling: “Also, as an artist and creator here are glimpses into the mind that made your beloved series and my thoughts on it...”
Everyone: “yes! We like to know things! We want more!”
Rowling: “Well.... I think I like if my character I created were a certain way and...”
Literally too many people: “Burn the witch! She’s ruining my ideas of the franchise with her stupid witch brain! Who told you to write Rowling?! Leave Harry Potter alone!”
it's not the fact that she's expanding her world, it's that she keeps adding stuff after the fact without,: writing a new book or there being any hint towards these facts in her books. it seems like shes adding these things to her series just to appeal to a new market of gay people.
Not that it matters to the public at large but I didn't personally ask for or want more books. I was quite content with the end of Harry Potter being the end of the world. -shrug-
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Oddly I also didn't get into Harry Potter for it's racial stigmatization or deep look into the characters' sex lives. It's well within her rights to bombarde as much information about it outside of the confines of the books as she wants, but it's also well within peoples' rights to find it a bit ridiculous when it. goes on endlessly and illogically.
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Admittedly equally to blame would probably be the people on the attack prodding her about these things, but eh.
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At the end of the day this was meant to be a more tongue-in-cheek lighthearted joke, but given the frequency of these, and the subject matter, I guess I shouldn't be so surprised people would take it so seriously
@mrsuperman8942 and @xvarnah- that’s likely why she put them as an asides “after the fact.” I had a gay coworker I didn’t know was gay for 4 years. It’s not that they hide it- it’s just it never came up in relevant conversation, and they don’t have a lot of glitter in their tank and are professional so... I mean- was dumbledore going to talk to his students about that “total stud” he bagged last weekend? Was he going to hit on his staff? Or would he organically work in to a conversation about Magical doomsday plots and arcane relics that he was gay? As you say- it wasn’t relevant to the plot and so wasn’t in the books. If anything I’d say the opposite- trying to shoehorn in an elderly gay romance thread to a character who plays a specific role in the series would’ve pandering. Like the commentary or added features or EU of starwars. The way that the Donkey Kong or Supermario games are simple side scrollers yet Nintendo has detailed backstories and side snippets for most of the...
... characters including bad guys who literally only get stomped on and exist as mass random Tripp’s to fillmlevrls with challenges. Eventually they worked some of this- but not all- into various titles. Lord of the rings is a perfect precedent of fantasy novel which is full of supplemental information from the author which isn’t in or is barely hinted at by the books themselves. At the end of the day books are words on a page and open to your imagination. There are arguments in pop culture older than many here. Some which creators have chimed in on. I don’t care what anyone says- to me- Deckard is human, and the events in total recall really happened in universe exactly on screen. So if you want to picture a character a certain way in your head regardless of what the author or the actual text says- that’s your perogotive. Nothing Rowling can do can reach into your mind and change what you want to imagine. However in her mind- the mind that imagined the books- she is sharing what her..
... vision is. There are fans past and present who would kill to have their favorite creator tell them more about the universe or characters or creation process or how they interpret the books themselves. Colleges hold special lectures for authors to do this, people pay money for special events or wait decades or more for a creator to speak on their own works. Here JK Rowling is giving fans a glimpse into her mind and many are the opposite of grateful. I love the works of Ray Bradbury- that doesn’t mean I have to like everything he says or does, and if he told me Jim and Frank were gay lovers I’d be a bit surprised, but otnwouodnt ruin the books for me. There isn’t much if arguably anything in the books to support it so one could easily ignore it if they liked- although I don’t see why one would since it changes nothing about the actual story or why I liked it and there’s nothing wrong with it.
Except what's in her mind often disagrees with what she actually wrote. Like saying Hermione could be black despite her book very clearly saying her "white face" at one point, AND jk rowling making a descriptory note of the skin color of most of the black characters (not to mention characters like Cho, Fleur, and Krum, who she adds fairly distinctive ethnical cues). At least, I *assume* it's most of them-- jk rowling hasn't come out and informed us the majority of students at Hogwarts were, in fact, half black and half Asian yet, so we'll see.
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If she wanted Hermione to be black I genuinely don't care, but for the love of God *write* the character *black* then. Don't swoop in after the fact. It's the same to me as turning up and saying "Ron wasn't actually a redhead."
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If she doesn't want people to care about what she actually wrote down vs what she wants to fantasize about outside of the stories, she should make that a great deal clearer.
I don't even have a problem with authors adding on or trying to clarify their world's outside their works-- lord knows Tolkien did it-- but this is the equivalent of Tolkien turning up and suddenly saying "Gandalf and Bilbo had a secret affair."
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And when I talk about her throwing in Dumbledore's sex life, I'm not even talking about the main series-- it's my understanding she has every intention of making it a big deal in one of the upcoming FBAWTFT movies. And she's now backed into a corner because she's mouthed off about it so much that she's damned if she does include it and damned if she doesn't. Again, it's her prerogative if she wants that to be the theme of the movies, but I, again, didn't get into Harry Potter for it's sweeping romantic landscapes and forced sexual thematics. Then again I wasn't super invested in the FBAWTFT movies to begin with. Or even in what JK rowling does behind the scenes. My usual reaction is an eyeroll and I move on with life.
Outside of maybe a comment or two, this is the literal first time I've stepped outside that box to poke fun at the behaviour. Because I do think it's funny behaviour.
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Authors and writers and movie makers etc are allowed to say whatever they want to. But at the end of the day books and such are supposed to speak for themselves. You have to assume your audience will see nothing but what's been presented to them. Everything else is just extras they may or may not happen upon.
And if Tolkien did in fact say Bilbo and Frodo and Gandalf and a ring wraith all buggered each other in the undying lands...? What if it? Now- it’s been covered before by fans and Rowling herself that the language used to describe Hermoune such as the “white face” people like to quote does not clearly indicate her complexion but can refer to emotions and or lighting. People also like to point out her red and visible blushing as though light skinned black people do not exist or cannot blush visibly either. Retcons happen all the time wether she meant Dumbledore as gay from day one or not. Luke and Leia weren’t brother and sister when the first movie was shot either. Ongoing fiction is dynamic. George Martin has made changes to GOT on the fly over what he had in mind originally as well. There isn’t a clear contradiction to prior established fact as would be the case if the explicitly red haired Ron Weasley was suddenly said to have always been blonde. It would be more like if she had...
... said “Ron’s hair was red in the pale light...” and people assumed he was a red head- but he were blonde or brunette and the light made his hair look red. You mention that it isn’t acceptable that Hermoine be black because she was never explicitly said to be black... but... was she ever explicitly said to be white? Words like “her Aryan visage..” or “she looked exactly like brad Pitt but as a woman..” or “Hermoine was a white girl who looked Anglo European” etc? So we can’t assume she is black because no where is it clearly said- but we can assume she is white when nowhere is it clearly said? Dumbeldore doesn’t have his sexuality adressed at any point in the series- so by default he is hetero sexual? What type of “set up” would be required to make that work? Should he have been a huge fan of techno, or had home decor magazines scattered about his office? Should Rowling have introduced his description something like “a real bear..” or “a royal twink in his day..” or “Known to be...
... the only wizard to have had a train ran on him by all the major houses...”? Like- what would the subtle and appropriate subtext relevant to anything dumbledore did in the main series be that he is gay? And if she is writing more stories and in those stories dumbledore and a gay romance are to be featured- wouldn’t it be relevant that his is gay? Is it relevant that harry is straight or at least bi? It plays a part of the narrative so it’s there- but it could be cut or modified without serious impact on the main story lines. Your book audience will see only what you put in your books. Fans have never seen the incredible hulks penis, or been made to know of Wolverines healing factor means that if he orgasms he will continue forever or for weeks. But fans speculate. Many want to know. The Matirx doesn’t show us much or tell us much of the machine war- but the creators and the Animatrix and EU cover that stuff.
You don’t need to watch the Animatrix to understand or enjoy the matrix. You don’t need to read Star Trek novels that cover the pasts and futures and alternate realities and in between episodes and movie times to understand and enjoy the series or films. Hell- you don’t even have to watch the films to watch the show or vice versa. Yet... it all exists. For those who want to know. If all you want to concern yourself with is what is in the book then whatever Rowling says has nothing to do with you. I didn’t need Aliens Colonial Marines the game to tell me its cannon Dwayne Hicks and Newt aren’t dead. I doregarded their deaths in Alien 3 outright because I thought it was bull crap- and largely it was. That film was a mess of patchwork scripts and shoddy production. So if you love Alien 3- ok. Good for you. For you- Hicks and Newt are dead. For me they never were- but it’s cannon now that they aren’t. People who make fan fics generally aren’t too concerned with cannon either. So if the...
.. author or cannon contradict what you want to believe- you can have you cannon or fanfic where Dumbledore beds 99 virile women daily and Hermoine looks and sounds like Kelly Anne Conway or Selma Hayak or Emma Watson. What happens in the books is Rowling’s story, what happens in yours is your own story based on the world of JK Rowling. It’s her world. If you don’t like what she does with it that sucks- but it’s hers to do what she wants with. If she announced wizards are aliens or mutants and starts a predator or marvel cross over- that would be lame IMHO- but it’s her ship to sail. What she doesn’t next doesn’t change what you want to believe. Although while a predator cross over I could see “ruining” the franchise I do question why so many are upset that a race or sexual orientation that had nothing to do with the story might not be what they thought.
If Tolkien DID say that, it then drastically changes the shape of his world since, with the ring wraith alone, that would open up the possibility that the wraith don't entirely answer to sauron, or else sauron somehow ordered them into this little tryst, which then begs the question is a single wraith capable of overpowering and raping all of those characters (including Gandalf), or did it somehow seduce them? Or did they capture and then rape it? If the wraith does have free will did it betray sauron? And if so why didn't such a major event actually have any impact on the overall story-- because the betrayal of an undead king bound to the will of sauron would be a pretty major event in the storyline. If gandalf and the hobbits are instead the rapists, do we still agree with the characters morally?
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These are the kinds of questions that come up when things like that get thrown out there but have no actual setting in the storyline. And these are the types of questions that should,
Really, only be reserved for fanfiction.
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By placing them in the open, without character definition, interaction, setting, reasoning, or guideline, you disrupt the entire story you were already trying to tell-- all while failing to provide proper context.
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I can't really touch on the Hermione thing any more because it's genuinely ridiculous and you can go around with hypothetical until kingdom come. If you want to believe she's black then by all means. She can be the one extremely pale, white-faced, freckled, black character that turns brown after summer holiday that JK Rowling didn't bother specifying about, and not a bizarre attempt to cater to the twitter crowd. I genuinely don't care if Hermione were to be black, but make the damn decision and stick to it for the love of God. Undermining your own written words years after the fact helps absolutely nothing
I'd honestly not thought about dumbledore's sexuality at all, personally. He was not presented as a sexual character, so I didn't think about it until she started saying "oh, well, he was definitely gay you know. I intended him to be gay." Alright, that's nice-- but based on the reaction, I'd say you very much failed to make your intentions clear in the book. And I'd say that, given the vast majority of the population is, in fact, heterosexual, when you're given no indication to believe otherwise, most people will assume that a character is heterosexual. Just like if you introduce a human female character most people will assume that somewhere in their body there is a vagina, two lungs, and a heart. Could this be false assumptions? Quite possibly-- but unless there's an indication otherwise you can't very well go around saying people are wrong or ridiculous for assuming a human would have lungs.
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Most of those questions don’t apply as Sauron was defeated by the time they were in the undying lands. It might raise questions to how the wrong wraith survived etc- but the undying lands isn’t explored extensively and so we don’t actually know the “rules” there. But- to bring us back from the tangent and ask if your examples for the kinds of questions such things bring up- what questions of the Harry Potter Universe are brought up of Hermoine is Black, or Dumbeldore is gay? Now- to be specific- what questions which would impact the story, or would have actually been answered in the story narrative? I mean there are always questions right? That’s the point of authors giving “behind the scenes” looks right? A story may make a point of telling you a characters favorite food- or it might not and the author might say: “Sauron enjoyed Grape Jelly before he was a giant eye.” That didn’t fit in the story- so it wasn’t mentioned- but some fan surely wonders what Saurons favorite food was,...
I feel it's important to point out that fanfiction is not, not ever has been, considered canon. From the little I know they have VERY strict rules about making it clear the stories are 100% imagination, not to be considered in any way connected with official works. Official voice actors for characters have even gotten in trouble for reading fanfiction at conventions. So lumping anything she says in with fanfiction implies it also should not be considered canon.
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I've never watched alien, star trek, or the matrix sequels, so every single analogy you're attempting to use involving them is being lost on me.
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At the end of the day all of this simply brings us back round to what I original said:
-it's her world, she can say what she wants
-But by making it public and including the world in general in it, we're allowed to have reactions to that. -shrug-
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I am genuinely so far beyond disinterested in going around on this anymore, so I apologize if you're looking for a long debate over a simple joke. I know there's probably a lot of people who would be happy to, but as I already said: I find her approach to this and the things she's said very poorly handled and often a little ridiculous. I'm not asking you to agree on that even a little. I can continue to find humor in the situation whether we disagree or not
... the type of music he listened to, so on. So we COULD say that Hermoine being black might raise questions about what it was like being a wizard of color- identity issues, how she felt about muggles treatment of people of color and how her experiences in the wizard of world differences or paralleled them, if her attitude to muggles was shaped by this or if she felt a certain way about her heritage etc. however these are different books than Harry Potter. JK Rowling didn’t write a series about the race relations of wizards and muggles or the story of a young female POC wizards self identity and world view. Those are all questions for fans to ask an author because they didn’t make it into a book. Not questions that change the fundamental story itself. The answers may or may not change the way a reader chooses to view events and characters in hindsight or not- but the events unfolded exactly the same as they did before and nothing about Hermoine or her role in the story would be...
... altered by it, not dumbledore. If one is not interested in the personal histories and intimate details of these characters one simply has to stick to what is on the page and leave the questions unanswered or answer them for themselves to their satisfaction. Fiction is full of such questions. Sometimes a creator answers them- many times they do not and all there is are fan theories or fans who just don’t care. Most authors and franchises do not get so detailed in apocrypha as Star Wars, Star Trek, or LOTR. sometimes after an author passes or years later notes or production material from films are found which answer long standing questions. People take it or leave it. So then the ultimate question remains- wether one likes an authors decisions or not- what authority does any third party have to tell a creator to their face that the world they made isn’t as they say it is?
If Rowling intended it so and it was fact- or merely decided tomorrow that in the final book of the series we discover that Harry Potter is the fever dream of a cholera stricken child, or the phsyciatric dillusions of an insane goat rapist in a gulag- that’s her perogotive. You don’t have to make it your head cannon but it is her vision of things. George Lucas’s version of Star Wars- his pre production version and his prequel films unfettered by the restrictions that forced him to make the original films known and loved- in my mind was total crap. Given free reign to create what HE wants for the franchise he makes garbage IMHO. But so long as he owned it that was his right. Who am I to tell him what he can do with his story? Same with Disney now. I don’t have to like it, or watch it, or even consider it “real.” But that’s their story, not mine. If I want it my way I can make my own.
JK Rowling: making this joke isnt funny you loser its time to stop
JK Rowling is mean to me.
Jk Rowling: “I’ve created a world from my imagination for you!”
Literally most people: “Yay!”
Jk Rowling: “here are more books and ideas from me!”
Literally more people: “yay! Keep them coming!”
Jk Rowling: “ok! I will! Here are plot twists and turns from my imagination!”
Literally more people: “Yes! But no! So sad, so good!”
Jk Rowling: “My books are done.”
Everyone: “Awwww...”
Rowling: “Ok. I’ll add more.”
Most everyone: “Yay.”
Rowling: “Also, as an artist and creator here are glimpses into the mind that made your beloved series and my thoughts on it...”
Everyone: “yes! We like to know things! We want more!”
Rowling: “Well.... I think I like if my character I created were a certain way and...”
Literally too many people: “Burn the witch! She’s ruining my ideas of the franchise with her stupid witch brain! Who told you to write Rowling?! Leave Harry Potter alone!”
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Oddly I also didn't get into Harry Potter for it's racial stigmatization or deep look into the characters' sex lives. It's well within her rights to bombarde as much information about it outside of the confines of the books as she wants, but it's also well within peoples' rights to find it a bit ridiculous when it. goes on endlessly and illogically.
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Admittedly equally to blame would probably be the people on the attack prodding her about these things, but eh.
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At the end of the day this was meant to be a more tongue-in-cheek lighthearted joke, but given the frequency of these, and the subject matter, I guess I shouldn't be so surprised people would take it so seriously
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If she wanted Hermione to be black I genuinely don't care, but for the love of God *write* the character *black* then. Don't swoop in after the fact. It's the same to me as turning up and saying "Ron wasn't actually a redhead."
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If she doesn't want people to care about what she actually wrote down vs what she wants to fantasize about outside of the stories, she should make that a great deal clearer.
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And when I talk about her throwing in Dumbledore's sex life, I'm not even talking about the main series-- it's my understanding she has every intention of making it a big deal in one of the upcoming FBAWTFT movies. And she's now backed into a corner because she's mouthed off about it so much that she's damned if she does include it and damned if she doesn't. Again, it's her prerogative if she wants that to be the theme of the movies, but I, again, didn't get into Harry Potter for it's sweeping romantic landscapes and forced sexual thematics. Then again I wasn't super invested in the FBAWTFT movies to begin with. Or even in what JK rowling does behind the scenes. My usual reaction is an eyeroll and I move on with life.
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Authors and writers and movie makers etc are allowed to say whatever they want to. But at the end of the day books and such are supposed to speak for themselves. You have to assume your audience will see nothing but what's been presented to them. Everything else is just extras they may or may not happen upon.
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These are the kinds of questions that come up when things like that get thrown out there but have no actual setting in the storyline. And these are the types of questions that should,
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By placing them in the open, without character definition, interaction, setting, reasoning, or guideline, you disrupt the entire story you were already trying to tell-- all while failing to provide proper context.
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I can't really touch on the Hermione thing any more because it's genuinely ridiculous and you can go around with hypothetical until kingdom come. If you want to believe she's black then by all means. She can be the one extremely pale, white-faced, freckled, black character that turns brown after summer holiday that JK Rowling didn't bother specifying about, and not a bizarre attempt to cater to the twitter crowd. I genuinely don't care if Hermione were to be black, but make the damn decision and stick to it for the love of God. Undermining your own written words years after the fact helps absolutely nothing
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I've never watched alien, star trek, or the matrix sequels, so every single analogy you're attempting to use involving them is being lost on me.
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At the end of the day all of this simply brings us back round to what I original said:
-it's her world, she can say what she wants
-But by making it public and including the world in general in it, we're allowed to have reactions to that. -shrug-
I am genuinely so far beyond disinterested in going around on this anymore, so I apologize if you're looking for a long debate over a simple joke. I know there's probably a lot of people who would be happy to, but as I already said: I find her approach to this and the things she's said very poorly handled and often a little ridiculous. I'm not asking you to agree on that even a little. I can continue to find humor in the situation whether we disagree or not