When the refugees from Syria started arriving Europe and it's Nations were quick to change the laws and close the borders while our politicians talked about how we couldn't let them overwhelm us. Now, all of a sudden, those laws and close borders are a problem and the politicians are fighting to show who loves Ukrainians more. Yeah, as someone who's been in a few election campaigns I think this meme is entirely accurate.
That's one perception. The opposite side is mired in that they chose to immigrate to a country that has wildly different ideas about religion/religious observance and culture. Ukraine and Poland are next door neighbors. They don't have to cross several countries and borders to get to each other, and their cultural values and norms aren't likely to react volatilely when exposed to each other.
I’m going to say that tarotnathers13th has a valid point- that it tends to be easier and more stable when groups of people who share the most similarities are integrated in one place vs. those who are very different. We can look at very homogeneous countries and see that while many factors come in to play, places like Japan or many Scandinavian countries that are very homogeneous in their populations and cultures and histories etc. do tend to run “more smoothly” than countries where you have many and/or vastly different people with different religions and values and histories and cultures etc. this holds true in the developed world as well as the less developed world- though it isn’t fair in that regard to compare significantly more developed or politically/economically established nations to those which are less so when looking at overall stability or “smoothness.” The point itself, not being disrespectful- is a tad self evident.
That said, there does become a valid question of the reasoning. It isn’t coincidence that people who are most like us tend to look like us etc- but just because people may look more like us doesn’t necessarily mean that they are more like us than those who do not. Linguistically there is a divide where English is a Germanic language and Ukrainian is a Slavic language. Both branches relate to Sanskrit, Greek, and other ancient languages but can’t both be said to derive from them or originate in them. They are distinctive. Culturally, there is a divide between them as well. Proximity is one indicator of shared culture but not definitive- and we must remember the history of Eastern Europe and more recent Cold War history which also creates cultural divides between the groups. It can be debated which cultures are most similar to each other or which differences make for the biggest barriers to mutually enjoyable integration.
In the case of refugee bias the question of wether certain groups are given preference due to similarity or prejudice can be open ended. While we can take it as a self evident truth that people tend to get song best with similar people, it is also a self evident truth supported by a long historical record that bias exists within certain groups towards others as very fundamental levels.
When discussing Europe especially the history of horrors and the modern horrific history of the Second World War and related events is quite relevant. Being mindful of history is how we avoid history repeating.. hopefully. But to the issue of dissimilar peoples- groups don’t become familiar and similar without sharing culture. If we ever want a “stranger” to be a friend we sort of must at some point reach across the table so to speak. After thousands of years Europe has had lots of contact within the continent but the groups we know today exist by the integration of once very different peoples into…
.. cohesive social groups that then formed group identities with their own unique subcultures. Spain and Germany and the UK etc. are made up of peoples from once different nations and ethnicities and before that tribes and such. We really no longer bother asking if someone is a Saxton or a Goth etc. so much as we might care if they’re from London or Sussex. It wasn’t always like that. So we must ask when we talk about this wether the case is that people are saying they don’t want to end up in a world where their own culture has adapted to the introduction of these new groups who one day would likely just be part of the larger group who shares similarities from the fused cultures and languages we get from mixing “different people.” That would certainly be xenophobic to say the least were it the case. Time stands still for no man or nation. Cultures change.
The underlying issue beyond all the culture and social stuff is pretty simple- if we say that admitting Ukrainians is different because they are more similar and thusly there is less disruption- we are essentially saying that we wouldn’t help them if they were more different right? That alone is a bit of a stark implication, but taken further logically, we are saying that we refuse to help a certain group of people because their survival isn’t worth the discomfort it might cause us to have to deal with people who are different than us. It’s harder to find a single impactful image for a photo meme to convey the humanitarian disgust at the concept: “we could help, but it would be inconvenient so it’s better if you just die or figure something else out.” This becomes especially problematic when we consider that most of the current unrest in areas like the Middle East traces to European and American meddling over the centuries. One might see a sense of obligation in such issues where one…
.. precipitated the crisis, and when coupled together we end up with a sentiment that “we made this problem but… you need to deal with it because we are no longer involved and it would be inconvenient for us.” That is one way to view the situation of course as well.
Well put and expanded on the subject as always @guest_. I suppose my basic point is I want to help when I see people suffer. I've seen people come to Sweden looking for safety from persecution and war and I've seen our authorities deport LGBTQ and children into war zones where they've been killed a few to many times and I'm frankly a bit horrified. I'm glad we're helping Ukrainians this time but I remember the Afghans, Syrians, Russians, Iranians and others who came to us for help and were sent back.
@karlboll- thank you for both your kind words and for sharing this information. One’s, or at least my own, mind doesn’t always jump straight to Sweden when thinking about European refugee issues, so it isn’t just a good reality check but also some unpleasant truths of perspective.
I’m really glad that there is so much support for Ukraine too, but also feel a little horrified thinking about all the other people who needed help or need help and have not gotten anywhere near the level of response- not just from Sweden of course, I mean from my own country and others as well. It’s sad. I’m glad you want to help, people wanting to see others helped is generally the foundation we can build help on.
Always works well
When discussing Europe especially the history of horrors and the modern horrific history of the Second World War and related events is quite relevant. Being mindful of history is how we avoid history repeating.. hopefully. But to the issue of dissimilar peoples- groups don’t become familiar and similar without sharing culture. If we ever want a “stranger” to be a friend we sort of must at some point reach across the table so to speak. After thousands of years Europe has had lots of contact within the continent but the groups we know today exist by the integration of once very different peoples into…
I’m really glad that there is so much support for Ukraine too, but also feel a little horrified thinking about all the other people who needed help or need help and have not gotten anywhere near the level of response- not just from Sweden of course, I mean from my own country and others as well. It’s sad. I’m glad you want to help, people wanting to see others helped is generally the foundation we can build help on.