That happens when people value traditions more than individuality. There are still a lot of present day parents who beat their kids. It's just that, a majority of them have come to their senses.
Think how much it would suck if you could actually factory reset someone. You would undo all the years of experience and training. Good luck potty training your 13 year old or if you are shitty enough your S.O.
Oh man yeah that sort of shit stays with you, my mum would ask me to come over to where she was so she wouldn’t have to put in the effort to walk to me. I’m so sorry :<
First I was demonstrated the proper behavior.
Then I was told the consequences of acting contrary to what I knew was right.
I got one reminder.
I got one warning.
Whatever happened next was entirely up to me.
I needed that discipline, but I was never struck in anger by my family.
Should it be necessary, I will raise my children in a similar manner.
There is now extensive research that is readily available and easily accessible that proves that corporal punishment and spanking are not only extremely damaging, but not as effective disciplinarily as many other options. Hitting children is easier than other disciplining techniques because it requires no self-discipline, and when it comes to raising humans, safety is kind of one of the major necessities that we develops loads of maladaptions without (like various symptoms of mental illness).
I agree you shouldn’t punish unless they understand why but violence doesn’t command respect, it creates fear and distrust. There are any number of consequences you can administer for bad behavior that don’t make your children fear you.
None of the others were likely developed when you were a child, and if they were, they were likely not easily accessible to your parents. You’re parents probably did they best they could with what they had. But now that we have the ability to do better by future generations, we owe it to them to put some effort into it.
I hope that if you have children, you take the time to research discipline techniques and child development, so that you can do your best. That’s all we can do. Continue to learn and grow, and try our best.
Did they call you fat to help you learn to be thin or stupid to make you learn to be smart? Is that helping someone grow? No. And beating your children doesn’t help them learn to form healthy relationships which is how they don’t end up thugs on the street.
They made me workout. They made me study. They showed me the way and then did what was necessary to keep me on the right track. Often times a word or a warning was necessary, sometimes a strike was.
Much like Drill Sergeants, they were eager to teach and understand, but discipline was paramount.
Otherwise? They spent time with me. We watched movies, played games, went into town, and did healthy family activities to foster that relationship, but there's a time for play, and a time for work.
I am forever grateful, and I wholly intend to gift any children I have with the same and better.
i am not saying that parents should be abusive sadists, i am saying children need to be taught discipline. I worked at Toys R Us for two years, the first six months i despised the disrespectful misbehaved cretins, but after a while i learned that the fault falls squarely on the parents. Parents who don't teach their children respect and good behavior are not doing them a service, they are bad parents. And if my kids don't listen to me after they have been told, a spanking is justified.
You guys are changing the subject from violence to discipline. Of course kids need to learn discipline but using violence to teach it is unnecessary and causes adverse effects in other parts of their psyche. Drill instructors teach discipline professionally but are not permitted to strike their recruits. Why can’t parents be held to that standard?
Drill Sergeants will kick a recruit's ass if he steps to them. They will rap your head during marksmanship training, they will kick your feet and shins during Drill and Ceremony training, and they will turn a blind eye if the rest of the company or platoon needs to "motivate" or "encourage" the ones who don't fall in line. And when all else fails, they send the fucker home.
There is beating children and then there is beating children. You're the one saying violence is never acceptable, we were talking about discipline from the start.
You cannot move the goal posts now. Either you are right, or we are right. And you'll find that our stance was nuanced from the start. So either it's never acceptable to lay a hand on a child, or you are wrong.
It's just a different style of teaching, i suppose. All I know is the real reason I never did drugs, smoked, drank (excessively), or knocked a girl up was because of the fear of God my mom put in me, not because of lectures in school. I am not socially retarded in any way (that i know of), i have very healthy relationships.
When you have a child and you can look them in the eye and then hit then that’s who you are. But would you beat a dog until it cries to discourage bad behavior? There are negative reinforcements people prefer to use with dogs that don’t involve violence. Children have many more of these options than dogs.
I am. I read “Often times a word or a warning was necessary, sometimes a strike was.” followed by planning to bring that behavior, along with the positive stuff, into the next generation. If you are reading mine you will notice the only point I’m disagreeing with is that a strike is ever necessary.
I will not fail them not instilling discipline. If a demonstration and explanation if the most that is required, perhaps with the occasional reward or loss of privileges, I will be happy.
If not, I will not hurt them by refusing to do what is necessary.
Then let me tell you about something I did that will explain why hitting is never necessary. When my kids were little I used “time out” as a corrective consequence. Many people scoff at it because they don’t know how to make it effective. Instead of putting them on the stairs and going about my normal business I put them in the stairs and then put a chair in front of them and sat in it and focused on them. If they took their hands off their knees or spoke I would stop them instantly. It only had to do it about three times (45min total) before an eyebrow raise was enough to correct them. Kids understand that the most committed get their way. Take the time to make the kids avoid the consequence not the parent. Don’t be lazy and just hit.
And what happens when they move or speak anyways? What happens when that raised brow doesn't cut it?
I walked away. I talked back. I took joy in challenging my parents in public. Being contrary was, is, my nature.
Until established boundaries were enforced with increasing severity.
I was prepared to sit there for hours. As I said, the most committed wins. Children have an underdeveloped sense of time so every minute for you is like 10 for them. I have used this with nephews who were known for their out of control behavior with great success. It’s not just time out. It’s demonstrating that you will always do what you say when you say you want them to act a certain way and you are willing to stop everything else in your life to get it. Combine them with making them feel like a peer (as much as is appropriate) when they behave and the effect is galvanizing.
If they want to act out you let them. They will burn themselves out while you watch calmly. Then just keep going like it never happened delivering whatever the promised consequence was. I assure you if you do that for the small and medium situations the large ones tend to never materialize. If you get frustrated or angry or lash out, you lose. They were more committed to getting you to react than you were to getting them to behave.
Hours? Some of us need to work for a living.
Burn out? Again, time is a precious thing.
Lash out? Any parent that administers any punishment in anger is a failure who is doing their child a disservice. In that moment, at there very least.
Yes. Hours. If you think that having children doesn’t mean a commitment of most of your day-to-day life, including time when you are at work, you are going to be in for a shock. When you have a kid you don’t have time anymore, they have time, your agenda is secondary.
I didn’t say you had to quit your job but you will get calls. You will have to leave early, etc. When you get home it will not be plop on the couch and have a beer before dinner. No more sleeping in on weekends. It’s not complex to have a child but it is relentless
Yup. I’m just describing your half. If your partner works then they’ve had just as long of a day as you and will expect you to split the responsibility once you are home: one cooks, the other is with the child (as an example). If they are stay-at-home they have been counting the minutes until you get back so you can take the kid for a while so they can do everything that popped up that day but they couldn’t get to. It’s Saturday, someone has to go shopping and the kid needs to go to whatever. Oh, and don’t forget their next well-visit is Tuesday and this is the one where they check the hearing. Do you think you could take them?
Here’s on they don’t tell you about: you are driving with the kid and have to piss like crazy. You pull up to a gas station and..? You can’t leave them in the car. You have to get them unbuckled and take them inside with you. Now you either have to hold the kid and your hog at the same time or risk having to cut off midstream when they make a bee-line for the dirty plunger.
Then I was told the consequences of acting contrary to what I knew was right.
I got one reminder.
I got one warning.
Whatever happened next was entirely up to me.
I needed that discipline, but I was never struck in anger by my family.
Should it be necessary, I will raise my children in a similar manner.
Much like Drill Sergeants, they were eager to teach and understand, but discipline was paramount.
Otherwise? They spent time with me. We watched movies, played games, went into town, and did healthy family activities to foster that relationship, but there's a time for play, and a time for work.
I am forever grateful, and I wholly intend to gift any children I have with the same and better.
There is beating children and then there is beating children. You're the one saying violence is never acceptable, we were talking about discipline from the start.
You cannot move the goal posts now. Either you are right, or we are right. And you'll find that our stance was nuanced from the start. So either it's never acceptable to lay a hand on a child, or you are wrong.
If not, I will not hurt them by refusing to do what is necessary.
I walked away. I talked back. I took joy in challenging my parents in public. Being contrary was, is, my nature.
Until established boundaries were enforced with increasing severity.
Burn out? Again, time is a precious thing.
Lash out? Any parent that administers any punishment in anger is a failure who is doing their child a disservice. In that moment, at there very least.