Well now- let’s be clear here. Not ALL anything is anything- especially when we are taking about personality traits. But here’s the thing- “predator” has such a negative connotation. Cats are generally predators. Dogs too. Sure, they scavenge- and most in domestication tend to prefer consensual and voluntary feeding- but still predators. Yet- you may hug your dog or cat. Spend time with them and never feel afraid of them. They generally aren’t predatory towards you. So “predator” and “predatory behavior” are linked but not synonymous.
That which isn’t a predator can still show predatory behavior- and the predator still has the choice to be kind to its friends and family or those or so chooses not to make its prey. So I mean... the whole “labels” thing kinda fails when we get granular to the point where we are referring to a specific person.
It’s an important distinction because well- pigs aren’t generally considered predators- but all it takes is a moment with the wrong pig and it can hurt or kill you as sure as any dog or big cat could. The nature of the beast is only part of the equation. Men can be predators, and men can not be. The same man can be both with different people or at different times.
A dog is a dog, a bear is a bear- either is potentially dangerous. One is more likely to be than the other if you treat it like it is safe as a pillow. If you assume every animal is just like a bear you’re going to miss out on a lot of potential good times. If you assume every animal is a dog you’re very likely to get hurt. Humans are animals. We have natures- instincts- drives. We are what we are.
I'm genuinely curious how many guys have experienced unwanted touching, particularly of a sexual nature, from women. And no, not sarcasm. Pretty sure all the people saying all men are sexual predators would be shocked (and then deliberately ignore) just how often it happens to men as well
I’ve actually had multiple male friends confess situations that made them uncomfortable and usually when they tell me they don’t even realize how bad it was they just sort of share like there’s this one thing that happened and I’ll be sitting there apologizing and trying to comfort the guy as he slowly realizes that he’s had to suppress those feelings for so long
I've definitely had unwanted sexual touching from different females over the years. It happened more while working in a restaurant. Here's a gross quote from a waitress that gave me a ride home one night. As she was dropping me off and I was thanking her, she put her hand on the inside of my upper thigh and said, "Hey can I come inside? I'll let YOU." I didn't know what she meant at first and I'd only just met her. I said something like, "Uh, thank you, no." She was creepy. Later, I found out she even had a bf at the time.
Sorry to hear Jasonmon. In my experience, unwanted advances or touching from women to men tend to be fairly common. Much of the time they are less “aggressive” or forward than men- more “subtle” but a touch is a touch in that regard. There’s traditionally a social stigma against women being sexually aggressive- but I think that it’s primarily social conditioning that makes that difference. By nature we are mostly “programmed” to be sexually predatory- all humans.
It’s in our genes to seek out healthy partners to reproduce with, monitor for signals of fertility or receptiveness, and reproduce. We have entire complex systems of our bodies dedicated to this. Without even thinking about it we subconsciously monitor and react to various (again often “automatic”) signals and signs of reproductive opportunity.
Like manners, or wearing pants, or using a toilet to go to the bathroom- civilization is about being more than our drives. To control our nature we must be aware of our nature. To deny our nature is to be at danger of unknowingly falling prey to it.
With women- the traditional view of women as passive or submissive when it comes to sex creates a danger. With men it was traditionally an acceptance that predatory behavior was an inherent part of “being a man” and not an impulse that can be controlled like wetting your pants.
Because we don’t generally recognize the sexuality of women in a non objective way, but as an active component, society and even many women themselves don’t think of themselves as having a potentially predatory nature. The effects of this are seen in social weighting of certain things. Letting a relatively unknown woman watch a male child isn’t seen as threateningly as a relatively unknown man with a female child. Male victims of female rape are often dismissed. A female adult raping an underage male is often cast almost in a heroic light by many. “I wish my teacher...” etc.
And we generally put the consent on a female. Not sure if you should hug, handshake, whatever or not? Wait and see what she does. Been working out? Nothing socially unacceptable about a woman feeling your chest or arms or stomach. But... it’s not seen so innocently if a man you barley know starts felling your pecs or your abs through your shirt as a woman who works out.
*not a “male rights” thing. Men face challenges but we are hardly at a point where men’s rights are the most fragile or oppressed thing in the world. But for the purpose of discussion these particular challenges are of note- as the issue doesn’t effect just men. It’s a social issue and the perception of women as “sexually passive” effects men and women negatively.
I'd say deeming it "less aggressive" is incorrect. Perhaps it's perceived as less aggressive because women are typically smaller. But from what I've seen/read/heard men have very often been the subject of women grabbing their genitals, climbing on top of them, saying over the top remarks like in Jason's situation, etc etc etc.
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At the end of the day, though, the purpose of this comment chain wasn't to debate who has it worse or the structure of society and sexuality as a whole. It's definitely an interesting topic and with discussion, but in this specific chain I genuinely just wanted to hear if anyone wanted to share their experiences on this matter. Because everything i've seen has lead me to the conclusion that women may be the victims of more violent assaults overall (which is STILL an extremely important issue), but whereas they often have outlets available to them in various forms.. Men are rarely even allowed to so much as talk about it.
@kcat it's been my experience that most men do just brush it off. I've had guys talk to me about scenarios that make my skin crawl and I ask them if they talked to anyone, if they brought it up to anyone, if they went to the police, the answer is always no. Some of them don't seem to be bothered and if that's how they feel then that's how they feel - if they don't feel victimized then not about to turn them into one. But others are clearly uncomfortable with what they went through
To be clear I am not debating nor saying anyone has it “worse.” Just presenting the issue as framed. As for “less aggressive” as was my primary point- women aren’t “less aggressive” but are perceived as less aggressive and socially conditioned in many societies to be less physically or overtly aggressive- a separate topic I’m not trying to get in to but examples include the way “strong women” or women in power are perceived compared to men, sports and physical activity, etc. the “gender qualities” traditionally encouraged and associated with each gender discouraged overt aggressiveness and in many ways still do- in women.
Any specific woman and her choice in participation to these traditional standards or how adherent to them she might be is subjective. On the whole however- the traditional “female” roles laid out by society tend to be less overtly aggressive. Dolls and not army men, cooking and not boxing, direct and decisive, nurturing and understanding etc.
I wasn't meaning to imply you were debating, I just know how our conversations tend to go haha. Technically I think I broke my own rule by offering a refuting viewpoint to begin with
I’d like to come out and admit I’m a sexual predator. Everyone makes us out to be evil but being able to turn invisible and see infrared is really cool. Also, the dreads are a turn on to the ladies. I should probably just shoot the haters with my shoulder gun.
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At the end of the day, though, the purpose of this comment chain wasn't to debate who has it worse or the structure of society and sexuality as a whole. It's definitely an interesting topic and with discussion, but in this specific chain I genuinely just wanted to hear if anyone wanted to share their experiences on this matter. Because everything i've seen has lead me to the conclusion that women may be the victims of more violent assaults overall (which is STILL an extremely important issue), but whereas they often have outlets available to them in various forms.. Men are rarely even allowed to so much as talk about it.