Trump is a meme that just keeps on giving <3

All of your words make me want to vomit.

The president- who but a week ago told America their kids were basically immune to pandemic- who has fluffed up our troops and spoken of his admiration and support, who campaigned on a slogan about how damn American he is- doesn’t know when WW2 even happened. Let that sink in. When he says “Make America Great Again” When is he talking about? Is he talking about “the post war boom of the 1930’s?” How the F&(k is he going to make America great again if he doesn’t even know when “America was great”?

Considering the opposition has yet to produce a more stomach-able alternative, speaks a lot about how great the political climate is at this point.

Mostly by doing what he was doing. Record low unemployment, record high jobs, stability with Korea, pressure on China and Russia, putting the Euros on notice, energy independence, ending the forever wars, not unilaterally burning other countries down, standing strong against racist proposals pushed in the name of "diversity", appointing constitutionalist judges, even refusing to court the RINOs and neocons. And mind you, the list is far from exhaustive, and it's what he's managed to do in spite of open sedition and being sabotaged by his predecessor and every old name in Washington, so it's even more impressive, and explains why he'd rather the branch he heads and maintains absolute authority in be filled with people he knows.

We knew we weren't electing a statesman for the first time in decades, and by Odin, it was paying off so well that the globalists and anti-Americans had to manufacture a health crisis, a race war, AND a nation wide anarchist riot, just to try and put creepy, sleepy Joe in a position where he can die to allow the ascension of one of the worst names in Washington.

@guest_ See? The virus and probably the opiate epidemic was "manufactured" to damage Trump, the race war came all of a sudden and from nowhere, and three blocks in Portland and some other cities are a nation wide riot. Who disagrees with the current policy is anti-American, a terrorist and basically has no right to claim any rights. That's straight away the fashion Trump is copying from his close friends Erdogan and Putin. Way to go.
I know why you still try to discuss, but boy, that train has left the station long time ago.

As usual, everything you said is wrong.

@nightkami- you should want to vomit. It is a natural human reaction in the face of grotesque truths.

@tarotnathers13th- I don’t know if the opposition has produced a suitable candidate for the better part of a century, but they’ve been in especially poor form of recent. But at this point- short of a full blown communist or something of that nature- to be the better candidate one really just has to be just about anyone else. The only real argument otherwise is to say that one prefers door number one because it has a shit sandwich behind it, to door number 2 because they don’t know if it is a shit sandwich or not. “The horrible and known is better than the unknown horror” gambit.

@famousone- f_kyeahhamburg and I are somewhat on the same page in our amazement. I must say- as much as I am still not entirely convinced that you aren’t either an amazing satirist, or a Chinese bot poster posing as the “ideal American” to make everyone, including Americans- develop strong sentiments against the nation through its association with you- or perhaps just a kid who hasn’t really gotten out of his comfort zone much- whichever it is you manage to take it to new heights consistently. And that- is an incredible feat worthy of a head nod regardless of ones thoughts on the issues.

That said- you did just say in earnest- that because his friends go along with him- that he is obviously a great man? And that is... in response to the post where I point out these “people who know him” tend to end up in jail...? If getting criminals to respect and follow you right up until they go to jail and you don’t is a sign of a great leader- wow. I wonder why more mobsters haven’t been elected?

But what is truly perhaps your magnum-oof-us, is where you say that anything anyone has done including nature/god- in the past 4 years, which isn’t roses- is a leftist ploy to undermine your Prophet. I particularly like how you then attribute every good thing that has happened in 4 years- to him, without consideration to the possibility that some may have been the work of others, or perhaps that such goods happened in spite of him?

And well- record unemployment? What are those numbers looking like today? “Corona...” yes yes. He didn’t cause Corona. We know the left planned that to undermine him, that’s just common knowledge. But- how is America doing relative to other countries? Because anyone can sail a boat with a favorable wind to where they want to go, a leader can steer it to the best course in turbulent waters.

What uh- how have his efforts to stop corona gone? How successful has he been in quelling civil unrest? How much money has Mexico sent us for the wall they’re paying for? You know- the 16 miles of wall the great lease of men has completed in his 4 years, 10 of so more terms and he’ll have it finished though I’m sure. But he got rid of Obama care, because people follow him. Oh. He didn’t. Well- his radical creation of HSA’s? No. Oh. Probably too busy with that $550billion infrastructure investment he promised. He’s got... 5 months left. Maybe he’s almost done?

He backed out of most of the harsh actions he took against China- largely after the disastrous repercussions lesser men warned him of occurred... ummm... gee. How long do you have?

But I went into this saying it wasn’t about politics. You wanted to talk politics. He’s a trash human and an ineffectual leader. He has broken- not “failed to uphold” but BROKEN- almost 50% of what he promised. There hasn’t been a president in the last 20 years who did so poorly at keeping their word to voters.

But none of that- and none of what you mention @famousone- has anything o do with what I said. The president of the USA doesn’t know what year THE COUNTRY HE RUNS fought its most influential war next to perhaps the revolution or civil war. The revolution being the war where our brave soldiers bombed the air fields of you recall.

That isn’t an “outsider.” That isn’t “not a politician.” That’s sub remedial. For a man born in 1946 that’s... a terrifying detachment from reality to grow up as the first year being born after one of the worlds most devastating conflicts and most massive wars... and think it happened 30+ years before you were born. And to me- it’s fucking insulting. A sitting president doesn’t know what year “the greatest generation” fought for the very survival or freedom, for the future of America- an event that literally created the world we live in.

Much like many other people- he talks out his ass and doesn’t know what he is taking about- but is convinced and often able to convince others who find reality confusing to face on its own terms- that he is an expert. And it isn’t the left that is dividing the nation alone- it takes at least two to tango- and as these divides widen to the point that left and right are both willing to say: “I wish y’all would succeed so we could have our country without you...” how has he brought people together and held the union together? What has he done to mend this divide? He’s actively fueled it.

Yeah, yeah, every bad thing is the orange man's fault, every good thing is thanks to the resistance, impeach him, Russian collusion, Chinese bots, on and on it goes. It was tired when Maxine vowed to IMPEEEEECH him, way back when he committed the original sin of beating Clinton.
Twist it however you want, he's done a lot of good, not nearly so much bad, has kept or fought to keep most of his promises, and is largely doing a much better job of staying in his lane than recent predecessors or rivals. Half your criticism is non-issues, a quarter are baseless, and the remaining are things I would love to attack myself if I didn't already know it'd be misconstrued as preferring a leftist or authoritarian.

I'd like you to list his campaign promises and how many he did.. seriously instead of talking out of your ass

Me or famousone? Plenty of people and fact checking sites have done so already and such lists can readily be found online for most presidents of the late 20th century. But I already listed out some of the major campaign promises he made and broke or did not uphold.

As to famousone- he’s just doing his usually thing. His cognition can’t deal with non binary reality so things must have two poles and nothing else. If you aren’t for Trump you are against him. If you think he’s ever done anything wrong you think he’s the devil. If you point to actual, factual, verifiable faults- poor famousone cannot retort then do jumps to his comfort zone of extremes, and jumps the shark. So because I pointed to things he cannot rebuke or defend- he has to label my entire argument as far leftist propaganda to try and discredit it that way, since he can’t argue on merit. It’s a whole thing. We’ve discussed it ad nauseam but it’s not something he’s interested in changing. He just likes to beat his chest in the guise of debate- and that’s his right.

I don't care to read or respond to fucking novels anymore. A man can only be dismissed, ridiculed, infantilized, ignored, etc., so much before he decides that it ain't worth the effort to be polite, respectful, or even to argue in good faith. You don't even realize when you regurgitate thoroughly debunked attacks, nor accept that a person can earnestly disagree on what is good and proper, do you?

I acknowledge and embrace disagreement on issues and- you can even see I recently defended a post that called for a cautious eye to mask laws- I am all for discussing views on right or wrong as moral perspectives. I made a post about a man being a moron and you replied with politics. That isn’t morality or concept in abstract- that’s functional debate on policy. What did anything you said have anything to do with the man being a moron or wether a president should know little details like when his country fought its largest scale war of the 20th century and a major world historical event?

You came in to a post pointing out how stupid the Clown in Chief is- and didn’t or couldn’t defend the subject at hand- and started taking about his politics. Great. I said- leaving his politics out of it- he’s a moron. You’re reply to that was- “Well- his politics...”

We’d had these talks. I’ve told you my thoughts and given you my advice on some places you could look. If a man is fed up being infantilized, ridiculed, and dismissed- a man should look closely at his words and behavior. There are ways to disagree in earnest like informed and educated adults, and those tend not to be dismissed, ridiculed, or infantilized. They aren’t always liked- but man... you say I bring yo debunked attacks- where did you point them out? You went into some thing about leftists starting Corona virus and conspiring to riot to undermine the prophet. How is a person supposed to respond to that?

As I suspected. You aren't even aware.

I wrote novels to you because in one 5 sentence or less post- you can say so much that is either probably wrong, or incredibly ambiguous that I’d need stenographers to get in to it fully. On topic- you’re totally ok with him not knowing when WW2 happened? You don’t see anything wrong with that? You trust a commander who doesn’t know when WW2 happened? I don’t trust a valet that doesn’t know when WW2 happened- or at least closer than 1917.

So long as he ain't about to destroy another country even after they do everything he asks.
You see, Trump doesn't exist in a vacuum. He was a response to Obama, Bush, and Clinton. He can only be compared to his predecessors and rivals. I don't fucking like it, I don't fucking like him, but I like what he's doing, the way he does his job, and most of what he's done since he was elected. So he could reveal himself to be the immortal Christ, Hitler, Cleopatra, or sentient tofu, and my biggest concern would be that he can't legally be POTUS.

You only insult the man to undermine his politics, otherwise this would simply be dismissed as the misspeak that it most probably is, so I'm ignoring the herring and responding to the actual issue. Covfefe.

That’s fine. I don’t like what he’s doing. I think he’s done some good he doesn’t get credit for- and I think a lot of good he gets credit for isn’t from him or is spaghetti he throws at the wall or luck. But- this is one of those places we just talked about. You like the job he’s doing. I do not. We can agree to disagree and if we are inclined- discuss the whys and what’s. As a president- he hasn’t done anything to directly cause me harm personally- so all I would have against him is harm he’s done others, and the fact he’s a moron.

He can be moronic as he pleases, every problem that runs rampant in my home states comes from those with (D)s by their name, and he is the only one towards the top who is actually putting law abiding American patriots first.

I don’t only insult him to undermine his politics. If I wanted to undermine his politics- as I just said before- I have legitimate beef with those and I would go after those case by case. I opened this thread saying that politics were left at the door- he’s an idiot. That has nothing to do with his politics any more than saying Clinton was a shitty dresser and a skeevy Guy has anything to do with his. He got his dick sucked in the big chair. That’s a personal thing, not a political thing.

@guest_ Clinton and Biden were and are NOT unknowns. Clinton was pushing hard to continue and escalate Middle eastern/Russian conflict into either full blown or proxy conflicts. She was also the most unscrupulous, cold blooded politician to ever run for office and the administration throughout Trump’s first term would let her get get away with the smallest of any of Trump’s real or perceived infractions. Biden is in a mental decline, the extent of which is not known, but the hideous double standard applied to him and Trump regarding health issues is astounding. He had deals with other foreign governments, China, Ukraine, and agreed and suggested using federal and state powers to hamper and hamstring Trump’s incoming administration.

Oh, but it's all political. Always is. Always has been. Always will be.

As said, Trump started putting people he knew into those positions because he couldn’t trust those already in to actually work at their jobs instead of playing resistance. Each year of his term has been plagued by such people, resulting in months long stretches of political nonsense like his impeachment, Peter Strzok and FBI obstruction and misuse of federal law, Russiagate, the Mueller Report. All I know is I will not vote for anyone who engaged in that cheerleading grandstanding

But check this out- guy sure seems to misspeak a lot. Especially for a guy who a major part of his job is speaking. But to be frank I don’t think he misspoke. I think there is a pattern to the things he says that shows he just either doesn’t know or doesn’t care about what he is talking about. I think that Biden is a bit looped too and we call that for what it is- but we’ve watched this guy say crazy shit and “misspeak” for 4 years as president and some odd before that- and I would accuse you f not wanting to admit the guy who’s doing things you like is probably as looped or just shy of Joe Biden.

He’s dumb dude. He’s not completely brain dead. He has made money, he’s pulled cons- or clever tricks of your prefer. He has some level of intelligence and ability- but he’s dumb. I’m sorry. But that’s all there is to it unless he’s going loopy upstairs or just completely careless- and none of those three things is desirable in a leader.

If you remember one of our many talks- something I’ve said multiple times- if you don’t show your work, or you show your work and it is wrong, even if the answer is right that doesn’t make you right- it is just as well luck.and coincidentally- what came up in this very back and forth? Covid. Bad luck. If he can fail on bad luck and not inability- he can’t succeed in good luck and not ability?

But maybe that’s one of those philosophical differences. I care about more than the ends. I want a president who gets the job done but I also want more than that from a president. I expect more. You don’t care how the thing is done as long as you like the results. Hence our constitutional debates. I defend the constitution as a process to follow to an ends, and you defend an ends using the parts of the constitution you like to justify it.

Negative. That is never how I've regarded the constitution. I'm just practical and pragmatic about what I expect from politicians. Learned that from Obama. He's got a phone and a pen, and we're still fucked up by his bull. Gotta remember, elections have consequences.

@tarotnathers13th- apparently he couldn’t trust the people who knew either. They ended up in jail, well... except the ones he sprung or fired guys for investigating. So I guess add bad judge of character to his list? As for Clinton- I was referring to Bill. Hillary wasn’t elected so we can’t say what would have happened. I personally wouldn’t vote for her- I don’t think she’d have made a good president. In 2016 we were stuck between this guy, a socialist whack job, and Hillary. So- we were pretty screwed and just got to choose the flavor of shit we ate, and who got the biggest share.

In 2020- lord help us. It’s- this guy- the one who is a moron or going loopy, probably an uncle bad touch, a president who doesn’t know US history (that seems perfectly appropriate...), is 90 years old, makes crooked and questionable deals with foreign nations and is a proven liar 50% of the time.... or a 90 year old who is going loopy or already half way there, probably an uncle bad touch, thinks black people are still a commodity to barter and work for you, makes crooked and questionable deals with foreign nations. It’s still a pretty shitty draft year it seems.

Easy to jail people when you follow Lavrentiy Pavlovich Beria's playbook.

Bernie in 2016 I could stomach, in 2020, no, his rhetoric has changed with his wealth. Shame the DNC rigged their nomination since they believed Hillary was a shoe in.

But I think you both misunderstand or miss my point- he’s very, very dumb. Dangerously so. With 50% broken promises and a very questionable track record on accomplishing what he set out to do- couples with being a moron- I’m saying that a good deal of what’s happened in 4 years has been the ship sailing itself while he stood at a fake steering wheel and wore a captains hat. Nothing unprecedentedly horrendous has happened under his administration. Revolting perhaps- but we all live and mostly had jobs until Covid. I think that’s fine. Good job, go home Donald, before the day comes your luck runs out.

Of the two... I don’t want to vote for either. But at least Biden- I think there’s a good chance that he could be removed from office pretty quickly on account of his missing marbles. So that gives him the edge to me because he’s the candidate most likely to end up with neither of these assholes in office. Problematically he chose Harris as VP- which takes some of that edge away since I don’t really think I’d want her as president when Joey goes to the padded room. Biden watched daddy do the job 4 years and now thinks he can do it. I don’t know he can. But as I said- it isn’t about politics. Trumps politics have have effectively no direct personal impact on me. I’m insulated so far. My life is mostly as it was 4 years ago or would likely be under anyone else.

It ain't a broken promise when you're actively working on it despite being sabotaged every step of the way, and he has been largely hands off, except for killing bad regulations, putting other countries on notice, stepping aside to let the commanders win the wars, appointing constitutionalist judges, reigning in executive employees tying to obstruct him, and refusing to let Democrat bullshit get passed his desk. That list is hardly exhaustive, but it is indisputable.

We're better off with Biden than Harris, but at this point everyone knows that a vote for him is a vote for her.

I don’t like him- but I’ll follow a good leader I don’t like, you don’t have to like people to work well together. But he is dangerous stupid. That’s my point. His brand of stupidity is dangerous, and it is insulting and embarrassing. I have higher standards for a president than “doesn’t start a nuclear war,” “manages the country 4 years without any major shifts in economy or most things...” and “built 16 Miles of a Wall.” My bar is set higher. And as what is primarily a figure head and a diplomat- he’s a shit diplomat wether he is or isn’t a good negotiator, and as a figure head he literally fails. People though Bush Jr. was dumb until 4 years ago. Now he looks like a freaking Proper scholar. That’s bad. Unless you like stupid. You’re allowed to like stupid. If that’s what you associate with and want associated with you- hey, good for you little buddies. I don’t like stupid.

He actively pacified the biggest nuclear threats. Nevermind the wall that was reinforced and refurbished, or border patrol's improvements.
The Euros will never like anyone who threatens our status as their piggy bank and blood donor, but as a negotiator he's done well in Asia and with the Euros, even the Middle East, too. Does Israel count as ME? Regardless. And that's in spite of a hostile domestic media actively trying to undermine and discredit him. A pretty awesome record on those fronts.

@tarotnathers13th- in 2016 I didn’t want him as president- but that doesn’t mean I don’t think he didn’t have any value in government, some of his thoughts or his voice. In 2020 I’d largely agree that, well- is it his wealth, perhaps the sting of- or having decided that people aren’t ready of “worthy” of his proposed revolutions, at being rejected by the masses when he carried a message that in theory should reverberate with the masses? I don’t know. While there are plenty of legitimate things to question with many of his ideas- the man faced a whole lot of bullshit in what was for everyone of all parties- one of the great bullshit fest elections. So maybe he’s just ready to say screw the revolution and enjoy his money. Lol. I can’t say.

@famousone- I don’t know. Hands off yes and no. He certainly has been hands on in taking on matters of personal interest or trying to issue executive orders- as for opposition he has been blocked on many things by opposition- but for most that’s not new. There was massive opposition and throngs of experts and laymen saying before the election was even held that many of these promises just couldn’t happen. But he kept making them. When a man makes a promise to bring the moon after being told by the world that is almost impossible- he either has what it takes to make the impossible possible, or he’s full of hot air. I do t think we can blame not getting it done on opposition when he and everyone else knew there would be opposition upfront. He kept saying he’d do these things despite that. He hasn’t delivered.

If he delivers in the next few months, or gets re elected and finishes then up in the next 4 years- well... can’t say he lied. He gave his word, he delivers or he doesn’t. How hard you try counts even when you fail, even if it doesn’t make an actual difference- but seeing that working WITH people instead of against is an option, and one that hasn’t been tried- personally I can’t give him credit for trying all that hard since he didn’t do everything reasonable to make good.

Negotiations are a point of contention as well. He did well? Did he? I don’t know. We aren’t at active war with China, South Korea, or Russia... but we also weren’t at war 4 years ago, or 8, or 16..... so “managing not to start a war” I can’t credit. Trade deals... meeehhhh... mixed results there. But that one is a bit abstract. I can’t say that increased costs for many Chinese supplies goods and materials, sales and jobs lost because of it, trade lost from “trade wars” and commerce lost from bans and such balances out any gains- but can’t say it doesn’t. That would take a lot of homework and with global politics and economics it can be many years or even decades before we see the true impact of things.

We shouldn’t bow to Europe, and it isn’t in America’s interests to give up our position in the global scheme of things. But there are also ways to accommodate and not alienate or enrage people while also getting what you want. That takes effort and diplomacy vs. being a bull in a china shop, which is easier and often more satisfying to the ego- but it’s also got its problems, and taking the easy road isn’t something that should go with being CIC if there are better options that just take more effort.

Pacifying nuclear threats is also a huge unknown right now. We have to see. Many analysts are worried that combinations of things like backing out of our deal with Iran and attacks on them could raise the threat level- or already has. America’s word is also now questionable in that regard as our country made a deal and then unilaterally broke it- or at least in the public view of things. What can be proved. So we don’t know what effects that will have on future diplomacy with Iran or others when they know every 4 years any deal they make with America could become just dust. Tensions with China haven’t been really deescalating either- increasing more like it. So we have yet to see if whatever short term gains will carry long term costs greater than what we got.

And yeah. Lol. Basically that’s a good way to put it. A vote for Biden is a vote for Harris. It’s a shot show- and my major point is and has been- politics and issues asides- Trump, wether one believes his ways are effective or not- acts as a lightening rod to divisions. His style is to pot people against each other, and the left has been floating garbage too- more division. I’m not saying we need a Democrat for president, find a good one first. I’m saying as I have been- we need a president with the tact and intelligence to appease both camps and the guts and grit to do what needs done at the same time. He isn’t that man. He could be useful in government- but he shouldn’t be our president. That’s my .02. Not because he’s conservative or a republican or “America first.” Because he doesn’t play the long game and he can’t unite a divided country- the thing America needs most of all in a time with so many global threats.