Idk I read the spear quote and my brain was just like
"well we have to tag him now."
"Why?"
"Because."
.
I don't usually win fights with myself so I went with it
Really? I'm going out and getting it as soon as I can. These books are awesome. I've never been more enthralled and there is not a single uninteresting character.
1
deleted
· 4 years ago
Dang autocorrect. Oathbringer.
Oathbringer's climax is fantastic and lasts a solid 200 pages.
Dalinar is my favorite character of the main trio. :) But I love all the characters. At least, all the ones you aren't supposed to hate.
I love how visceral the characters are, and how they all have to deal with some form of mental illness, and the fact that they develop magic doesn't cure that. Kaladin still has to fight through his depression, Dalinar deals with PTSD, and Shallan has an interesting firm of DID. There are confirmed LGBT characters, without making that their whole identity. Renarin is canonically autistic, and Jasnah is asexual.
Oathbringer has some of my favorite quotes. You're in for a treat!
I mean... it’s Catchy. Sounds cool. But..... I don’t know that it really pencils out? Like- a spear can pretty much either break/fatigue/deteriorate, or... not, and the conditions under which that occurs are pretty much constant. We might not know HOW MUCH any spear might react to those conditions- but it’s behavior can be predicted to basically 2 broad categories. Spears, regular ones, not magic ones or ones using annoyed or such- after they are forged, thus more or less it. You can sharpen them or hone them- but that just removes material and doesn’t change the properties of the spear. It is static to whatever material it is made of, except for degradation.
But a person is always in a state of “forging” as we are never complete really, never “finished” forming and changing until we die (and maybe not even then- who knows?) a spear was either going to break or not when a certain force was applied- based on its flaws and design and such, whereas a human can adapt as they go. You never know what you’re made of unless it’s tested I suppose, but what a human is “made of” changes constantly.
So to get direct to the application here- the spear that survived the battle is weaker than it was before the battle. It has been fatigued. So while battle may reveal which spears were strongest to start, it also makes them weaker, that’s how materials work. Which is somewhat not the inspirational point this is intending to make- that your trauma has revealed the strength you HAD but you are now weaker for having survived the trauma?
Now- trauma doesn’t “make” a person anything- a combination of things including the effects of the trauma on a person and how that person deals with that trauma combine towards the continuing development of the person we become as we accumulate life experience.
But it is a touch of semantics- does repeated use make the spear less sharp? The spear gets less sharp with repeated use, but it’s a bunch of physics and mechanical forces and such that make it less sharp” right? Or... is it the user who makes it less sharp? Rust will dull most metal blades if they just sit- but say we have a spear made of something like a material that doesn’t corrode/oxidize or does so very slowly? If you never use the that spear, it would more or less stay sharp for effectively lifetimes at least.
But sort of a key factor here is intent, or awareness. Agency. Wether trauma “makes us” anything, kind, mean, scared, whatever... has a complement of awareness. Say that I want you to support me in a meeting. Now let’s say that I trick you into doing so... did I “make you support me?” Technically I manipulated you. You just lacked the awareness to realize what was being done. Regardless- you performed an action that perhaps wasn’t your will- it was imposed upon you.
Likewise- if I coerce you, bribe you, or even if I threaten you (eg: “if you don’t back me on this, I’ll reveal your secret/destroy something/someone you love...” etc.) did I MAKE you? I mean- you still had some sort of choice didn’t you? You just took the choice that seemed best from the options you were aware you had. Of course- you could have other options you may not have thought of- ways to prevent me from getting what I want while also getting what you want; or the only options might be those 2. But there’s still an option there- even if it’s not a “good one” right?
Really, if we want to be absolutists- there is always a choice in life, and we choose the thing that might not be aligned to who we WANT to be, but shows who we are in a pinch. “Kill your spouse or your child, or all 3 of you die.” well... you could kill yourself there most likely, whatever happens next might be bad but you aren’t involved. You could choose all 3, thereby not having to make a choice between the two. That’s not the logical “win”, it’s a total loss, but morally it doesn’t require confronting any harsh truths.
But with trauma, if we don’t recognize our trauma, if we don’t understand it, and we don’t understand what effects it has on us.... then any sort of illusions we have about being in charge of ourselves are kinda proven false. How do we know what is controlling or manipulating our actions and thoughts if we don’t know what IS behind them?
One could argue that they are unaffected, that they don’t have to know or understand to know they aren’t being “made” anything by trauma, because their traumas don’t affect them. But then... 1. That isn’t technically a trauma if you aren’t affected by it, and 2. Being unaffected by things doesn’t prove strength. There are all sorts of creatures that can shrug off things that would kill humans, but die from things like a slight change in temperature or PH, by eating some relative common food we eat everyday, and so on. I mean- if you insult someone all day to their face and they don’t get hurt by it, it’s not really “strength” in the emotional sense of they aren’t hurt because they are too dumb or oblivious to notice right? Not having something as a weakness isn’t the same thing as being strong. Nuanced, but important.
We could play semantics all day. Like- if you say “my trauma didn’t make me kind, not wanting others to suffer like I did made me kind!” Well... that sounds more empowering for sure. But... what compelled you, inspired you, drove you... to not want others to suffer how you did? Well... you suffering the way you did right? And that suffering.... caused trauma..... and that trauma.... probably was at least partially involved in your decision making process on the whole “other people shouldn’t have to go through this thing” yeah? So... if I bump your laptop and it falls off the table, I’m the entity that has some concept of will or control in that equation... but it’s friction and gravity that made it fall, inertia and other physics that made it break- not me... right?
So I mean... semantics asides- we as people play a huge role in who we are and who we become, that goes for trauma and that goes for everyday too. If we want to split hairs we could probably better state this as “my trauma was the catalyst to a path of development to become kinder.” “My experiences with my trauma informed my thought processes and I made a decision to become kinder slams try to prevent others from having these negative experiences and feelings...” etc etc.
But that really only applies if you made a conscious decision. If you understood your trauma and were able to manifest some sort of self control. Because if you simply went through something traumatic and didn’t consciously process that, but became kinder afterwards.... you didn’t decide to be kinder, your trauma changed the way your brain processes information and thus affected your behavior. So in large part the distinction comes down to what is a choice we make, and what is a byproduct of changes to our brains caused by traumatic events.
Of course... there’s a lot of room to argue- big picture (not going to get in to THAT, wether we actually have any choice or control over ourselves or not), and wether or not certain changes to our thoughts and behaviors caused by the types of actual physical restructuring of the brain which trauma can cause, are subject to choice or not; and to what extent that applies.
Does a person with PTSD have a choice to just- “chill out” if their PTSD is triggered? Can a rape survivor make the decision to stop feeling vulnerable? Well.... generally not the same way one decides to tie a shoe or which drink to get. Not a simple decision. But we know that with therapy or coping mechanisms or practice or other mental exercise that some people can overcome involuntary reactions caused after experiencing trauma. But we also know it everyone can, and few people are ever so “in control” that they can simply exist as though they’d never experienced an extreme trauma after the fact.
So the question of choice is an important one. Wether or not an action is being done by is because we choose to do so, and would have chosen to do so even without that trauma, and wether or not we are only making that choice because of the trauma, or more directly if because of the trauma we find ourselves incapable of making any other choice; or if the only other choice besides the one we are making would leave us non functional as human beings. In that last one there is a “choice,” but the options are “do this and be able to function” and “don’t do it, and not be able to function.” So there is a choice but not really on that scenario.
At the end of the day- meh. Whatever. If it’s how you cope or what makes you feel better about something that happened, or what you need to tell yourself to keep moving.... it isn’t my place to say anything so long as it isn’t unhealthy and it isn’t causing one problematic thought processes or behaviors which become the problems of others who don’t wish to be involved. It is what it is I suppose, but while poetic and empowering- I find the metaphor lacking in logic.
Oh that's awesome, Lydia! I hope it goes well. Though even if it doesn't don't be discouraged. Therapists are like shoes - sometimes it takes awhile to find one that fits just right
I just had it, so I thought I'd just say something here.
.
She managed to pick up emotions in my voice that I could barely notice myself!
She could tell over the phone when I was anxious, which was honestly kinda impressive. She could also somehow hear me shaking at one point after we briefly discussed some of my trauma lmfao.
.
It certainly went a lot better than last time, because the first time I tried to get help, I was turned away because I was mute at the time.
.
It wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, honestly :3
Oh that's really exciting Lydia! Sometimes having someone actually willing to *listen,* not just hear, makes all the difference
.
I really hope this continues to go well for you :) it sounds like you've had to keep a lot of stuff bottled up in your life. Keep me(us?) Updated if you feel comfortable doing so, yea? :)
Well I don't really agree, the trauma did make me kind because as the first person said, I don't want people to go through what I've been through. But without the trauma, I would not have known what it felt like and thus would likely not have changed my outlook on life.
However, it's true that I didn't become magically kind from suffering, it was a process, triggered by said trauma and followed by me.
I mean, the trauma effected you. But far too often victims of trauma actually go on to repeat cycles of abuse. The trauma gives you perspective... how you handle that determines whether you're kind
If the trauma made you kind, why do we not allow parents to spank their children; why am I not allowed to throat punch an asshole; don't you want a kinder world... spread the niceness, pass the bitchslap around.
Nature vs. Nurture. They seem to neglect an important factor in that argument. Freedom of choice. Who you are is the choices you make. You are kind or unkind because of choices. Circumstances help you discover who you are. They don't mold you.
"well we have to tag him now."
"Why?"
"Because."
.
I don't usually win fights with myself so I went with it
Oathbringer's climax is fantastic and lasts a solid 200 pages.
Dalinar is my favorite character of the main trio. :) But I love all the characters. At least, all the ones you aren't supposed to hate.
I love how visceral the characters are, and how they all have to deal with some form of mental illness, and the fact that they develop magic doesn't cure that. Kaladin still has to fight through his depression, Dalinar deals with PTSD, and Shallan has an interesting firm of DID. There are confirmed LGBT characters, without making that their whole identity. Renarin is canonically autistic, and Jasnah is asexual.
Oathbringer has some of my favorite quotes. You're in for a treat!
I'm actually having my first therapist appointment in a few days!
:3
.
She managed to pick up emotions in my voice that I could barely notice myself!
She could tell over the phone when I was anxious, which was honestly kinda impressive. She could also somehow hear me shaking at one point after we briefly discussed some of my trauma lmfao.
.
It certainly went a lot better than last time, because the first time I tried to get help, I was turned away because I was mute at the time.
.
It wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, honestly :3
.
I really hope this continues to go well for you :) it sounds like you've had to keep a lot of stuff bottled up in your life. Keep me(us?) Updated if you feel comfortable doing so, yea? :)
However, it's true that I didn't become magically kind from suffering, it was a process, triggered by said trauma and followed by me.